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Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

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Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#191

Post by dkuntz2 »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #148
dkuntz2 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that happens, all someone needs to do is repackage Debian's version of aptitude for Ubuntu. Or an older version from Ubuntu. Really, this is a non-issue on Linux, because either 1) someone will just "fix" it an release their alternative, or 2) everyone will just stop using the offender.

Depends on what type of software you are talking about. For copyright protected proprietary software (which Canonical want people to develop for their OS) there may be legal protections which prevent it from being rebundled outside of torrent sites (which have their own risks). #2 assumes a savvy enough userbase.

Legal protections against rebundling aptitude? Something released under the GPL? Which means everyone has all of the ability to easily change the sucker.

If you're packaging something as a deb, you can potentially bundle other things, but at the same time, because a deb is a glorified tar.gz, someone can just provide information on how to get rid of the offending thing.

Or, if you're using Arch, the AUR maintainer just adjusts the PKGBUILD to do it for you.

It's not particularly hard.

And sure, having people install a different package manager requires a savvy enough userbase, to an extent. If they can copy and paste a couple commands into the terminal, they can change it (wget [somefile] && dpkg -i [somefile]). How hard.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#192

Post by radley »

patio11 wrote: post #152

So when earlier it was mentioned, I assumed "They have to have a different angle on this; they're a YC company." And seeing a strong thread title and no evidence for it other than "The industry they're in is ridiculously seedy", I thought maybe HN was in rush to judgement mode. So I thought I'd try, you know, installing something. Make your own call: http://images1.bingocardcreator.com/blog-images/hn/its-not-a...

I took a look at your image and started a search for Babylon Browser. Autofill added stuff like "hijack" and "took over my browser".

Sounds like very bad news:

https://www.google.com/search?q=babylon+browser

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#193

Post by tomjen3 »

patio11 wrote: post #152

So when earlier it was mentioned, I assumed "They have to have a different angle on this; they're a YC company." And seeing a strong thread title and no evidence for it other than "The industry they're in is ridiculously seedy", I thought maybe HN was in rush to judgement mode. So I thought I'd try, you know, installing something. Make your own call: http://images1.bingocardcreator.com/blog-images/hn/its-not-a...

Great file name.

But yeah, these people really chose to do evil, in a shady business. Why? Why not start the next scientology, that would make them more money.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#194

Post by mbetter »

kybernetyk wrote: post #24

The crapware situation on Windows is horrible. I'm a Mac/Linux user but from time to time I have to power up my Windows VM. A few days ago I wanted to install the Partition Magic trial on my Win XP VM. Having left Windows around 2005 I figured that typing "Partition Magic Win XP download" in Google would be helpful. I got a handful of "reputable" download sources like CNet and the like. I went there and was bombarded…

CNet hasn't been a reputable download source for some time.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#195

Post by tobylane »

jbk wrote: post #151
kbutler wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Googling for "vlc", "vlc download", or "vlc player", the top 3-4 results are all to videolan.org. Ads may distort this for some users, though...

Maybe because I spent almost 3 hours per week to clean it.

What do you do, what proportion of your time is advancing yours or flagging them?

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#196

Post by smacktoward »

scrumper wrote: post #158
Aardwolf wrote: post #133

This is the reason why I don't understand that people say that Linux is for "technical" users while Windows is for regular consumers. In Linux it's easier to install something that in Windows. E.g. to install a CD to MP3 rip program, in Archlinux all you do is: # Search for some mp3 ripper program pacman -Ss mp3 | grep rip # Install one of them from the list that looked ok from the description pacman -S ripperx In Wi…

Because the assumed knowledge required to understand the procedure under Archlinux is vast compared to that under Windows. Here are the concepts you need to know in order to do the work under Archlinux: 0. How to load your terminal program 1. The command line 2. Permissions/root 3. Package managers in general 4. pacman in particular (what, it's not the game?) 5. Command line switches 6. Piping 7. grep 8. What "looks…

Your overall point is correct, but your "under Windows" example is oversimplified. The Windows user still needs to know:

1) What an "installer" is

2) Where on the filesystem it goes when it's downloaded

3) How to navigate to that location in Explorer

4) That double-clicking the installer runs it

etc.

Some of these are things that you can learn from general Windows usage, but then the same could be said of several of the points you listed under Linux. And there are alternate approaches to installing software in Linux (like Ubuntu's Software Center) that remove the command-line, piping, grep, etc.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#197

Post by scrumper »

webreac wrote: post #178
keyboardP wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How exactly is a regular customer going to know what to type and where? Many have trouble with a GUI, let alone a CLI. And Archlinux is just one of many distros and has its own idiosyncracies (e.g. "Pacman" isn't going to work on Ubuntu out the box). Installation of crapware has nothing to do with ease of installation, you've just purposefully made it seem drawn out. You could've just said Google "CD to MP3" and a fe…

I am a linux user (linux mint cinnamon). When I need a new software, I launch the software manager, I type in the search criteria. This gives me a list of software. When I click a software, I have a list of users feedbacks and an install button. When I click install, it asks for my password and that is all. When I am on the command line and I type a command that is not installed, I get: jef@sweethome ~ $ 7z The progr…

> I am a linux user (linux mint cinnamon). When I need a new software, I launch the software manager, I type in the search criteria. This gives me a list of software. When I click a software, I have a list of users feedbacks and an install button. When I click install, it asks for my password and that is all.

Which isn't all that different to the app stores on other platforms. It's quite a long way from Aardwolf's command line pacman stuff above though.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#198

Post by [deleted] »

Aardwolf wrote: post #133

This is the reason why I don't understand that people say that Linux is for "technical" users while Windows is for regular consumers. In Linux it's easier to install something that in Windows. E.g. to install a CD to MP3 rip program, in Archlinux all you do is: # Search for some mp3 ripper program pacman -Ss mp3 | grep rip # Install one of them from the list that looked ok from the description pacman -S ripperx In Wi…

[deleted]

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#199

Post by BCM43 »

munin wrote: post #175
loucal wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that's a legit fear... Linux on the desktop in 2013 is fairly 'popular' and if it were that simple to infiltrate popular repos with spyware it would have been done years ago. There are a ton of good people who work to keep those repos clean. Lets not trivialize their contribution by acting like anyone and their mother can make changes to the repo for a popular distro. Sure, a black[/grey] hat can make th…

infiltrating a repo is probably not the hard part, the hard part is getting a linux app that people would want to install. AFAIK, 0 QC or checking is done on the contents of a repo. additionally, there have been enough times in the past where someone has just straight up rooted the servers that the repo lives on ...

AFAIK, 0 QC or checking is done on the contents of a repo. additionally, there have been enough times in the past where someone has just straight up rooted the servers that the repo lives on

Are you talking about debian/fedora repos? Because if so, that is simply false. Both have heavy QC, and the packages are all signed by the developers keys, and the OS checks those keys.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#200

Post by bcoates »

Aardwolf wrote: post #133

This is the reason why I don't understand that people say that Linux is for "technical" users while Windows is for regular consumers. In Linux it's easier to install something that in Windows. E.g. to install a CD to MP3 rip program, in Archlinux all you do is: # Search for some mp3 ripper program pacman -Ss mp3 | grep rip # Install one of them from the list that looked ok from the description pacman -S ripperx In Wi…

If I wanted to rip an Audio CD into an MP3 on Windows I would insert the CD, which causes a popup dialog that offers to run the built-in media player that includes MP3 ripping.
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