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Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

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Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#71

Post by glesica »

alanctgardner2 wrote: post #20
darklajid wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, Windows freeware developers offer their software for free. Their choice. If they agree that they 'deserve some compensation' for their work, they should sell it.

Why does Gittip exist then? It's funny that some developers should be compensated for the positive externalities of their work, but only the ones you deem appropriate. Working with this company would be choosing to 'sell' your work in a more accessible way. If you don't like it, don't install the bundled software and mail the dev a dollar

Gittip doesn't try to trick you into giving anyone money. It is a completely deliberate action on the part of the donor.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#72

Post by ewolf »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #50
Adirael wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of OS X apps are installed by dragging the app to /Applications, no installer involved, it may be one of the reasons.

Not familiar with the OSX installation procedure, but I assume that dragging the app into the folder runs some installer script? Are there perhaps restrictions on what can be done via these scripts that would require 2 distinct actions to install say a browser toolbar and application?

Nope, no installer script. If a program needs installer script (to install drivers etc.), you get a package installer (like on Windows), however, they are rather rare and I've never seen any crapware in those so far.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#73

Post by [deleted] »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #50
Adirael wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of OS X apps are installed by dragging the app to /Applications, no installer involved, it may be one of the reasons.

Not familiar with the OSX installation procedure, but I assume that dragging the app into the folder runs some installer script? Are there perhaps restrictions on what can be done via these scripts that would require 2 distinct actions to install say a browser toolbar and application?

[deleted]

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#74

Post by amorphid »

btipling wrote: post #6

Winzip and Nero use the Ask Partner Network (I used to work there on the Ask Toolbar) to monetize their free software, so that is probably where that first email came from. http://apn.ask.com/ There's also conduit: http://toolbar.conduit.com/

I believe offering the Ask bloatware is how BitTorrent finally ended up making money. I guess there's not much money in p2p filesharing.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#75

Post by nonamegiven »

darklajid wrote: post #11

That's the lowest possible way to make money: Sneaking by and behind the back of your users. If you feel you're entitled to more money, make me pay more for your product. Ask me to donate. Strip away features unless I go 'pro'. But never ever install crap that isn't even related to your product. Rule of thumb: If you wouldn't install that software on your families (like, the wider network - parents, siblings, grandpa…

"If you wouldn't install that software on your families (like, the wider network - parents, siblings, grandparents) machines"

Except those people probably would do that.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#76

Post by Jamiecon »

swies wrote: post #16

Y Combinator also funded our solution to crapware. http://ninite.com Basically we automate multiple installers and decline toolbars just like you would. Users range from the nontechnical to NASA. We even have a huge blind user base because these installers are frequently hell to navigate with a screenreader. We make money selling a Pro version with extra features to businesses and school IT departments. It works well…

Just wanted to add my thanks for a great product. We are a pro license holder where I work, I believe.

Not sure if this was your point, but I assume that you are using a lot of MSI and Windows API hooks, in which case this is a great example of the flexibility and integration options of Windows being leveraged for the good, as opposed to the crapware blight, which must be as frustrating for Microsoft as it is for us.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#77

Post by rrrrtttt »

There's a public company in Israel called Babylon whose business model is giving away a popular translator software in exchange for installing spyware. They're huge and are planning an American IPO this year. Some people here are saying that it's all a big stack of cards and investors are going to lose all their money, but the analysts are actually saying that it's a valid business model and the company is underpriced. I'm wondering who is right...

How is this business model of spying on your users different from Google's or Facebook's?

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#78

Post by jiggy2011 »

coderdude wrote: post #53
jiggy2011 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the end user is not the customer here, so the perception of their brand in the users eyes is nowhere near as important as the ROI they can deliver for the bundleware vendors. Think of it like the IRS, they don't increase the tax take by being nice to people.

So who cares about their image then? The original software vendor, probably. If they bundle crap with your install then take it up with them. If enough people did then they would probably stop using this company. So it all comes back to them eventually. Even if it's not in a negative PR way.

That doesn't seem to have happened so far. It's difficult to find free Windows programs that don't come bundled with some crapware these days.

As mentioned elsewhere a lot of these things are actually open source software products that have been rebundled, thus the reputation they are hurting is not their own.

I expect it is partly also a result of Windows devs who start out trying to make money by selling a "pro" version of their software but then find that either enough people are happy with the free version and a good chunk of the remaining users just pirate the pro version anyway.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#79

Post by MatthewPhillips »

longzheng wrote: post #14
btipling wrote: post #6

Winzip and Nero use the Ask Partner Network (I used to work there on the Ask Toolbar) to monetize their free software, so that is probably where that first email came from. http://apn.ask.com/ There's also conduit: http://toolbar.conduit.com/

It wasn't Ask or Conduit. It was actually a company I had trusted. That is before I received their email...

Why don't you name them? You're doing everyone a disservice by keeping their dirty secret.

Re: Y Combinator is funding the future of spam in Windows

#80

Post by jvzr »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #50
Adirael wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of OS X apps are installed by dragging the app to /Applications, no installer involved, it may be one of the reasons.

Not familiar with the OSX installation procedure, but I assume that dragging the app into the folder runs some installer script? Are there perhaps restrictions on what can be done via these scripts that would require 2 distinct actions to install say a browser toolbar and application?

Dragging an app into /Applications does just that: it copies a directory (hidden with an .app extension) that contains resources and executable. No script.

Some apps however come with an installer, but that's for apps that do more (e.g. need to install drivers, etc.). However, it's Apple's own installer which I think is provided by Xcode. So, no way to mess with it and install crappy things.

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