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Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

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Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#21

Post by lucian303 »

adrianm wrote: post #20
lucian303 wrote: post #15

Linux is NOT an OS and Linus did not create the OS. The OS is GNU the kernel is Linux. Thus you are comparing numbers for a kernel (Linux in Android OS versions) vs. numbers of OS's (Windows, OSX, iOS). This isn't a technicality either. Get it straight because as the article stands, it's unresearched garbage.

I've heard the argument that Linux is not actually an OS several times; but I must admit I don't completely understand it. Why is it so inappropriate to conflate the operating system with the kernel? Perhaps this is just the operating systems course I took in college talking, but I recall that an operating system is defined not by the programs in user space, but rather by how everything is handled behind the scenes;…

The OS is way more than the kernel. Device drivers for example. Compilers (while technically ran in user-land, try to build a kernel without them). Etc, etc. I don't know what they teach you at school, but I'm sure you can figure it out from here on.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#22

Post by lucian303 »

aleprok wrote: post #18
lucian303 wrote: post #15

Linux is NOT an OS and Linus did not create the OS. The OS is GNU the kernel is Linux. Thus you are comparing numbers for a kernel (Linux in Android OS versions) vs. numbers of OS's (Windows, OSX, iOS). This isn't a technicality either. Get it straight because as the article stands, it's unresearched garbage.

GNU is not either the operation system as without Hurd, Linux or some other kernel you can not use the GNU tools. GNU/Linux is a collection of software which forms the operation system though this collection can contain even more software and with different collection it becomes different operation system which is why Android is Android and Ubuntu is Ubuntu, etc. But Linux will always be the key component of operatio…

And without GNU tools, Linux by itself is also useless without GNU tools (unless you can compile C by hand). GNU/Linux is the OS. Ubuntu, Fedora, etc. are distributions of this OS.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#24

Post by rayiner »

keithpeter wrote: post #16
Hawkee wrote: post #6

The most striking statistic to me was Microsoft's drop from 97% to 20% over the past 12 years.

Because the range of devices we decide to include has increased?

I think a more appropriate charecterization is that the range of devices people use for daily computing has expanded.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#25

Post by rayiner »

brudgers wrote: post #12

My cars have computers which are not running Linux. Same for my microwave oven. A smartphone more closely approximates their level of end user programmability than it approximates that of an iMac. The article splits the world in a way which justifies the desired conclusion. It reminds me of the way the Amiga press used to hype even the most indirect cultural references as evidence of its impending success (yes, I kno…

Comparing a smart phone to a microwave oven is disingenuous. I'm HN-ing on my smart phone right now, which is something I used to schlep out of bed and plop myself in front of my PC to do.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#26

Post by aleprok »

lucian303 wrote: post #22
aleprok wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GNU is not either the operation system as without Hurd, Linux or some other kernel you can not use the GNU tools. GNU/Linux is a collection of software which forms the operation system though this collection can contain even more software and with different collection it becomes different operation system which is why Android is Android and Ubuntu is Ubuntu, etc. But Linux will always be the key component of operatio…

And without GNU tools, Linux by itself is also useless without GNU tools (unless you can compile C by hand). GNU/Linux is the OS. Ubuntu, Fedora, etc. are distributions of this OS.

You seriously think GCC is the only C compiler which exists? Though now you understood that GNU/Linux is the OS and not only GNU. Though it is true that you need to patch the stock Linux to compile it with some other compiler like Intel CC.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#27

Post by adrianm »

lucian303 wrote: post #21
adrianm wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard the argument that Linux is not actually an OS several times; but I must admit I don't completely understand it. Why is it so inappropriate to conflate the operating system with the kernel? Perhaps this is just the operating systems course I took in college talking, but I recall that an operating system is defined not by the programs in user space, but rather by how everything is handled behind the scenes;…

The OS is way more than the kernel. Device drivers for example. Compilers (while technically ran in user-land, try to build a kernel without them). Etc, etc. I don't know what they teach you at school, but I'm sure you can figure it out from here on.

"I don't know what they teach you in school, but I'm pretty sure you can figure it out from here on."

Your statement is pretty condescending. I'm not sure what I said to deserve that.

"The OS is way more than the kernel. Device drivers for example. Compilers..."

Your first sentence makes a broad generalization. As far as device drivers go; the operating system provides the interface for such drivers to be programmed and work together with other devices in a way that should be transparent to the programmer. This is part of the I/O system that an OS should provide. Classic OS responsibility, but not "way more than the kernel". The interfaces are provided by the kernel.

As far as compilers go, I obviously agree they are a necessary component of any extensible platform; but they are not 'technically' ran in user-land. They ARE application/user programs! They are not part of the operating system.

If you insist on playing the "technicality" card here, you can't have it both ways.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#28

Post by brudgers »

martinced wrote: post #10

A lot of people have Android devices. And TV decoders running Linux. And routers running Linux. And the trend ain't stopping anytime soon: it's hard to compete with free and open. That's when you do really want to go back to the late nineties, on Usenet, where all the MS fanbois kept singing: "Nothing to see, move along, Unix is dying and Windows is going to conquer everything, including the server space". How farsig…

That's when you do really want to go back to the late nineties, on Usenet, where all the MS fanbois kept singing: "Nothing to see, move along, Unix is dying and Windows is going to conquer everything, including the server space".

Replace:

  "90's" with "teens."
  "Usenet" with "HN."
  "MS" and "Windows" with "Linux."
  "Unix" with "Windows."
Same song. Different day.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#29

Post by SoftwareMaven »

microtonal wrote: post #3

In the graph, there is a sudden change in 2005, where (I guess) mobile devices were added. What I don't get is how Apple jumps to 21%, given that the iPhone was not introduced before 2007. Edit: from the linked Seattle Times article: I asked Goldman Sachs about what happened in the 2004-2005 time frame -- as seen in the above chart -- that made Apple's vendor share jump, Microsoft's share plummet and the "other" cate…

They had to have started including iPods and other mp3 devices that year. It is obviously a change in data gathering, because nothing that exciting changed that year. Even when the iPhone came out, it was a show ramp that didn't really pick up until the 3G.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#30

Post by brudgers »

xradionut wrote: post #19
martinced wrote: post #10

A lot of people have Android devices. And TV decoders running Linux. And routers running Linux. And the trend ain't stopping anytime soon: it's hard to compete with free and open. That's when you do really want to go back to the late nineties, on Usenet, where all the MS fanbois kept singing: "Nothing to see, move along, Unix is dying and Windows is going to conquer everything, including the server space". How farsig…

Usenet trolls then are the equivalent of the political blog spam today. In the nineties, Linux/OSS wasn't as mature/widespread and hardware for small devices sucked in performance and price. People wanted OSes and shit that just "worked". Installing and configuring "alternate" OSes in the '90s was painful even for experienced professionals and hobbyists. And the applications and user experience wasn't that great comp…

But the average computer user cannot, painlessly.

Though Linux has gotten easier to install, the average computer user is relatively less proficient than they were a dozen years ago.

Linux is not tailored for most people because of its fragmentation and the depth to which FOSS ideology drives its development. Supporting Linux is bothersome to the point that Red Hat run a lucrative business doing so.

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