Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices • Hacker News Board

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#11

Post by betterunix » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 2:16 PM UTC

ivix wrote: post #9

TallGuyShort wrote: post #5

Although it's technically running the Linux kernel, I personally would not consider it a free (libre) operating system as sold on most of those devices. I'm sure Linus is proud, but this seems like more of a win for Google than for the Linux community or free software in general.

It's not "technically" running the Linux kernel, it IS running the linux kernel. It's also using most of the standard GNU tools - bash, etc. You can open a shell on a rooted android device and use it much like any other distribution. This is a huge win for Linux.

"You can open a shell on a rooted android device and use it much like any other distribution"

Assuming, of course, that you can actually root it.

"This is a huge win for Linux."

Is it? What was won, exactly? If we are not seeing a more vibrant free software ecosystem as a result, then we did not really win anything. The prevalence of app stores, the number of Android devices that are difficult to jailbreak or for which no jailbreaking tools are available yet, and the partitioning of "users" and "developers" in the Android ecosystem are not positive things for Linux or for GNU.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#12

Post by brudgers » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 2:26 PM UTC

My cars have computers which are not running Linux. Same for my microwave oven. A smartphone more closely approximates their level of end user programmability than it approximates that of an iMac.

The article splits the world in a way which justifies the desired conclusion. It reminds me of the way the Amiga press used to hype even the most indirect cultural references as evidence of its impending success (yes, I know the scale was different, it's the behavior which is parallel).

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#13

Post by micampe » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 2:39 PM UTC

microtonal wrote: post #3

In the graph, there is a sudden change in 2005, where (I guess) mobile devices were added. What I don't get is how Apple jumps to 21%, given that the iPhone was not introduced before 2007. Edit: from the linked Seattle Times article: I asked Goldman Sachs about what happened in the 2004-2005 time frame -- as seen in the above chart -- that made Apple's vendor share jump, Microsoft's share plummet and the "other" cate…

That could have been the Intel transition but, although announced in 2005, the first Intel Macs were actually available in 2006.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#14

Post by jeltz » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 2:50 PM UTC

dan1234 wrote: post #4

I thought OS X and iOS were derived from BSD. Is the graph supposed to be generic Unix/Unix like OSs or should Apple not be included in this? Or am I just wrong?

OS X is based on NeXTSTEP which is in turn based on Mach. Mach is a micro kernel based on BSD.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#15

Post by lucian303 » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 2:50 PM UTC

Linux is NOT an OS and Linus did not create the OS. The OS is GNU the kernel is Linux. Thus you are comparing numbers for a kernel (Linux in Android OS versions) vs. numbers of OS's (Windows, OSX, iOS). This isn't a technicality either.

Get it straight because as the article stands, it's unresearched garbage.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#16

Post by keithpeter » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 3:08 PM UTC

Hawkee wrote: post #6

The most striking statistic to me was Microsoft's drop from 97% to 20% over the past 12 years.

Because the range of devices we decide to include has increased?

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#17

Post by recoiledsnake » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 3:09 PM UTC

>For Microsoft the situation is not as good. The combined share of Redmond’s different operating systems fell from 97% in 2000 to an estimated 20% in 2012. Apple, with OS X and iOS, grabs a 24% share.

So does this mean anti-monopoly restrictions must be lifted on Microsoft in the US and the EU? Why is Microsoft being unfairly targeted by, for example, being forced to include a browser choosing dialog in the EU while Apple gets a free pass for Safari inspite of having a higher marketshare and the lockdown of alternate browser engines and Javascript interpreters on iPhones and iPads?

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#18

Post by aleprok » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 3:11 PM UTC

lucian303 wrote: post #15

Linux is NOT an OS and Linus did not create the OS. The OS is GNU the kernel is Linux. Thus you are comparing numbers for a kernel (Linux in Android OS versions) vs. numbers of OS's (Windows, OSX, iOS). This isn't a technicality either. Get it straight because as the article stands, it's unresearched garbage.

GNU is not either the operation system as without Hurd, Linux or some other kernel you can not use the GNU tools. GNU/Linux is a collection of software which forms the operation system though this collection can contain even more software and with different collection it becomes different operation system which is why Android is Android and Ubuntu is Ubuntu, etc. But Linux will always be the key component of operation systems using Linux as kernel and we Linux fan boys will always be happy when Linux is used as a Kernel and will follow metrics about operation systems using it.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#19

Post by xradionut » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 3:14 PM UTC

martinced wrote: post #10

A lot of people have Android devices. And TV decoders running Linux. And routers running Linux. And the trend ain't stopping anytime soon: it's hard to compete with free and open. That's when you do really want to go back to the late nineties, on Usenet, where all the MS fanbois kept singing: "Nothing to see, move along, Unix is dying and Windows is going to conquer everything, including the server space". How farsig…

Usenet trolls then are the equivalent of the political blog spam today.

In the nineties, Linux/OSS wasn't as mature/widespread and hardware for small devices sucked in performance and price. People wanted OSes and shit that just "worked". Installing and configuring "alternate" OSes in the '90s was painful even for experienced professionals and hobbyists. And the applications and user experience wasn't that great compared to what we have now.

Now days I can install Linux on a mainstream laptop, restrict Windows to a VM and actually get shit done without any or that much pain.

Re: Linux now on 42% of consumer computing devices

#20

Post by adrianm » Sun, Dec 30, 2012, 3:17 PM UTC

lucian303 wrote: post #15

Linux is NOT an OS and Linus did not create the OS. The OS is GNU the kernel is Linux. Thus you are comparing numbers for a kernel (Linux in Android OS versions) vs. numbers of OS's (Windows, OSX, iOS). This isn't a technicality either. Get it straight because as the article stands, it's unresearched garbage.

I've heard the argument that Linux is not actually an OS several times; but I must admit I don't completely understand it. Why is it so inappropriate to conflate the operating system with the kernel?

Perhaps this is just the operating systems course I took in college talking, but I recall that an operating system is defined not by the programs in user space, but rather by how everything is handled behind the scenes; in kernel space.

Process management, threads, interprocess communication, memory management, the file system structure, input/output, network primitives... Aren't these responsibilities of the operating system? All of these programs and low level interfaces are provided by the operating system, and thus by Linux and not by the GNU utilities.