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The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

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Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#161

Post by FrojoS »

bcbrown wrote: post #153
conroe64 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is a trick I learned biking around in cold Las Vegas nights to warm your hands. Squeeze whatever you are holding hard, (or make a fist and squueze) in pulses about a second apart. It will force the blood through, like a miniature heart, and your hands won't feel cold at all.

Another trick that I learned from my ski team was to do arm circles. The centripetal force forces blood into your extremities.

Even better, keep your arms on the side of your trunk, your elbows straight and flex your hands at 90 deg so they point away sideways. Now, move your shoulders up and down. Don't use any other joints. Each down move of the shoulder will pump blood into your hands with high pressure.

We call it the penguin dance.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#162

Post by gonzo »

sanotehu wrote: post #84
gonzo wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a medical student you'll appreciate that I have a 3-4" stint replacing a section of my aorta, starting about 1mm away from the aortic root. This to repair an ascending aortic dissection that terminates in my left iliac. I walked out of the hospital, but the recovery was a PITA. My core temp got down to 18C (65-66F) for over an hour. (According to the surgical notes I was on the heart lung machine for over 4 hours,…

I think it's a testament to modern medicine that we can do these sorts of things. Glad to hear you got through the recovery alright. With the operation I saw, they packed the patient's head with ice bags as well as cooling the blood. I remember thinking to myself that I'd hate to be that guy waking up! Something like a large hangover ;)

Oh yeah, 20 years ago and I'd have never survived the night.

Whole thing is here, http://aorticdissection.com/2011/12/06/jim-thompson-47/ though I assumed that the termination was the right iliac until last Spring, when I had them run a CT on the lower extremities, and found that the termination was in my left leg (and that the false lumen had blocked the iliac in my right leg.)

Maybe when you're a doctor you'll remember, "When the symptoms don't make sense, think dissection" and save someone else.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#163

Post by mpyne »

lectrick wrote: post #48
billyjobob wrote: post #20

How old is this article? It seems to use the old Fahrenheit temperature scale. I'm sure my grandfather would understand those temperatures but for myself I had to convert each one into modern units. Eventually I couldn't be bothered and stopped reading.

Frankly I'd rather use a system where 0 degrees is "fucking cold" and 100 degrees is "fucking hot", but neither fatally so, with 100 different steps in between.

Meh, I've stopped trying to ever argue stuff like this. There is simply a large class of people who will never believe in l10n if it involves en_US, only if it's any other country or region in the world.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#164

Post by protomyth »

rdl wrote: post #115
protomyth wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Often, in a blizzard, the cell towers fail. On a side not, at home, the local phone company tends to be pretty good at keeping the line going even when power fails. Last time, I got stuck 20 hours without power, the phone line worked the whole time. The cell towers did not.

If I lived in a non-urban area, I'd probably keep an Iridium handsets in my car again. $500 or so for a used one, and you can get cheap plans.

A CB will do just fine and be able to reach people who might be able to help you.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#165

Post by protomyth »

johnbellone wrote: post #49
mobweb wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no cell service, or the cell service is only for Verizon phones I remember reading somewhere that emergency calls can use any network.

If you have a phone you can make an emergency call from it as long as there is service. The different networks have different frequencies and if your phone doesn't have the antenna its not going to work. This is more than just CDMA vs. GSM, although not sure about GPRS. I was a big fan of the Android phones that had AM/FM radios awhile back. At least you'd be able to hear broadcasts to have a general idea of where th…

A dedicated radio (one with a hand crank) is better, much longer life and not too expensive just to leave in the car's emergency pack. Hand cranked LED isn't bad either.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#167

Post by Sam_Odio »

jzwinck wrote: post #137
Sam_Odio wrote: post #71

I carry a PLB at all times in my vehicle [1]. In the US this device will summon rescue via satellite. I recommend it for anyone who spends time in remote areas. If you value your life at $1MM and there's a 1 in 3500 chance [2] that summoning emergency services in a remote area will save your life then this is a helpful risk-mitigating tool [3]. 1. http://www.amazon.com/ACR-Electronics-ResQLink-Personal-Loca... 2. $28…

Your statistics are seriously flawed. For example, your math in point 2 assumes you will certainly find yourself in a life threatening situation while carrying the device. And your point 3 probably vastly overestimates the fraction of life-or-death calls.

Your statistics are seriously flawed.

Actually, I think you a) misunderstood the claim in point 2, and b) take issue with the assumptions - not the math/statistics - in point 3.

your math in point 2 assumes you will certainly find yourself in a life threatening situation while carrying the device.

In point 2 the likelihood of a life threatening situation was not assumed or calculated (that's point 3). The conclusion, restated: If there's a 1/3500 chance you'll be able to effectively use the device to save your life, you're breaking even while mitigating risk.

And your point 3 probably vastly overestimates the fraction of life-or-death calls.

You've stated that I've made assumptions and you're right - which is why they're labeled as such. Feel free to suggest yours.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#168

Post by samstave »

Hoff wrote: post #111
andyl wrote: post #74

I teach search and rescue people how to travel on skis or snowshoes and live in winter mountains. If you are prepared, you can stay out in sub-zero for days and days very comfortably. A key skill is constant regulation of your body temperature. You never want to become too hot/sweaty or too cold. If too cold - get into shelter, drink something hot, eat carbs, add clothes, move faster. If too hot - remove clothes, or…

If you're out with others when it's cold, be aware of the "umbles": Stumbles, fumbles, mumbles and grumbles. These can be relatively early external signs of altered mentation and potentially of the on-set of hypothermia. Hypothermia can occur even in fairly warm temperatures, too; you don't need freezing temperatures. When carrying food, remember you're going to be eating a whole lot more when it's cold and you're ex…

Never go out with Flint Fireforge. Got it.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#169

Post by justin66 »

ars wrote: post #112
justin66 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keeping the exhaust clear would be worthwhile even if it means going out in the snow and doing some work. You should be doing that anyway: your best chance of being found is brushing most of the snow off the top of the vehicle so someone passing by or overhead is sure to see it.

The exhaust will clear itself if it's only snow. It's quite hot and will melt the snow very fast.

I tend to agree that the person I was responding to was probably exaggerating the risk, although if you've just spun the car into a field, it's buried in deep snow, and you've got a known leaky exhaust, it couldn't hurt. The "leaky exhaust" part is tricky: I had a friend once whose car's exhaust (and everything else) was so rusty you wouldn't want to sit in it when it was stationary. It was almost comically dangerous the way the car would fill with exhaust smoke.

The value of getting out and clearing the top of the car is very great regardless. A vehicle is much more recognizable as a vehicle when it's not covered with snow.

Re: The Cold Hard Facts of Freezing to Death (1997)

#170

Post by philwelch »

raverbashing wrote: post #128
MichaelApproved wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That reminds me of the sad story of CNet editor James Kim. He got caught in a snow storm with his family. He left the car and died trying to get help. His family was rescued in good condition. Had he stayed with them, they all would have survived. http://news.cnet.com/2100-1028_3-6141498.html

Today, in the age of gps enabled cell phones there is no reason to leave the car (unless there's a risk of explosion, car sliding off a cliff, etc, etc) Get your position, call 911, wait. If the signal is not good enough to make a call, send an SMS

If you have any cellular reception at all, you're generally not lost or stuck in the wilderness and at risk of freezing to death.
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