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LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

tomshardware.com

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Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#121

Post by bryan0 »

> "LG TVs process voice data only when the voice button on the remote control is pressed and held, or when a wake word such as 'Hi LG' is recognized after the user has activated the Far-Field voice recognition feature."

> LG went on to say that beyond the aforementioned instances, "the TVs do not collect or record ambient conversations."

LG is contradicting themselves here. In order to detect a wake word then they must be collecting or recording ambient conversations.

I think the main questions are:

1. Is it fully supported to use LG TVs disconnected from the internet.

2. Are wake word voice controls and ACR truly opt-in. They claim it is in the statement but (as others have mentioned) I remain skeptical what definition of “opt-in” they are using.

Update: some of this is becoming a semantic discussion on the definitions of “recording” and “collecting”, but to circumvent this I would say:

If a device can detect words in my ambient conversations and depending on what it detects (accurate or not) it can send that audio to the cloud, I would describe that device as “collecting or recording ambient conversations”

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#122

Post by redwall_hp »

dawnerd wrote: post #21
vincnetas wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they detail, but no one reads that anyways

And if anyone didn’t watch GN’s video on it, it’s thousands of pages of text requiring a button press to scroll each. It’s designed for no one to read. We should have laws that limit this kinda of “agreements”

The GDPR does. Consent to data processing must be unambiguous, accessible, informed in plain language with no legal or technical jargon, and not have any preselected boxes.

https://gdpr.eu/gdpr-consent-requirements/

The problem is the capacity to litigate is far surpassed by the world's speed and volume of doing bad.

This is a case where companies' actions should be treated like parking tickets: a fine is issued summarily, with option to appeal, not a slow process of litigation having to happen before a fine is issued.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#123

Post by OroPla »

derf_ wrote: post #11
seanieb wrote: post #9

The only reason TV’s are getting cheaper is the business model changed. Now your viewing data (and perhaps conversations) are part of their product offering.

I don't need the TV to be cheaper. I can afford to make up the difference for whatever few hundred dollars extra they would earn selling my data. But the expensive ones do this stuff, too.

I recently solved this problem by buying the Dell U5226KW. It has the same height as a 16:9 42" TV, but is 21:9, so a lot wider. It costs about four times as much as a similar sized 16:9 TV and you can't get it any bigger.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#124

Post by BeetleB »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

> So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible.

It apparently is.

Do you know the Nielsen Ratings? That's exactly how they know what people are watching these days. I've been contacted by them to be one of their subjects. They ship you a device that listens and recognizes based on content. They look for certain "fingerprints" in the audio and match against that - it's not capable of recording our conversations, etc (or so they claimed).

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#125

Post by juiceland »

xethos wrote: post #99
NooneAtAll3 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology so they aren't even denying listening in on everything?

"Everything" would include the microphone, both in the remote and the TV. They're claiming to split off the audio, with one path going to the speakers (and there to your ears), and the other path being hashed (and from there to LG). They still claim to get your media's audio, but deny using the microphones.

If they don’t use the microphones why do they have a statement in their Terms of Service to not say sensitive things in front of your TV? It says the TV owner is "solely responsible" for obtaining all necessary consents from third parties whose voices may be recorded by the device, and must warn household members and guests that their voices may be recorded, and if someone does not agree, the TV's microphone and voice functions need to be turned off. [0]

[0] https://www.lg.com/us/terms

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#127

Post by IshKebab »

firefoxd wrote: post #110

"We own the glass" that's what really stood out to me. I can still disconnect my TV from wifi. But what scares me is when every device comes with their own esim and cellular radio.

They don't need that - look up Amazon Sidewalk.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#128

Post by gruez »

bryan0 wrote: post #121

> "LG TVs process voice data only when the voice button on the remote control is pressed and held, or when a wake word such as 'Hi LG' is recognized after the user has activated the Far-Field voice recognition feature." > LG went on to say that beyond the aforementioned instances, "the TVs do not collect or record ambient conversations." LG is contradicting themselves here. In order to detect a wake word then they mu…

>LG is contradicting themselves here. In order to detect a wake word then they must be collecting or recording ambient conversations.

No, it's arguably accurate because "record" implies it's being persisted. Otherwise something as simple as a sound meter (which needs a microphone to operate) is "recording".

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#129

Post by llm_nerd »

NooneAtAll3 wrote: post #86
rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

> ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology so they aren't even denying listening in on everything?

They explicitly state that the audio ACR is done through the "TV’s internal audio processor". e.g. rendered audio, not recorded audio. I mean, you could stretch the claim to have it internal include recorded audio, but that seems dubious.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#130

Post by crmd »

bryan0 wrote: post #121

> "LG TVs process voice data only when the voice button on the remote control is pressed and held, or when a wake word such as 'Hi LG' is recognized after the user has activated the Far-Field voice recognition feature." > LG went on to say that beyond the aforementioned instances, "the TVs do not collect or record ambient conversations." LG is contradicting themselves here. In order to detect a wake word then they mu…

Seems like these weasels are using the James Clapper definition of the words “collecting” and “recording”.
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