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LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

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Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#61

Post by OptionX »

ZoneZealot wrote: post #50
seanalltogether wrote: post #20

ACR is "not enabled by default"? Is this actually true or is it one of those weasley technicalities where the tv ships with it turned off, but once you connect the tv to the internet it turns on?

Technically when you turn the TV on for the first time, ACR is not enabled. Ergo, not enabled by default. Sure, to use the TV you need to go past the EULA screen. And the button right in front of you, pre-selected - is agree to all terms. And after pressing OK, you now have ACR turned on. But you did that, it wasn't on by default. Okay I can take my soul sucking corporate hat off now.

Soul sucking is right.

Its looks like the sort of stuff that happens to a tragic fantasy hero after a Faustian deal. Except they would've asked for riches, love or eternal youth, we on the other hand just want our middling-quality tv to work.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#62

Post by cogman10 »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

> So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible.

It's probably easier to do and every bit as accurate as just using a screenshot.

And it's still exactly what I don't want them doing. There's literally zero reason for LG to be building an advertising profile on me because I was foolish enough to buy one of their TVs. This isn't something that makes their products better, it's spying.

Here's how it's been done in the past

https://www.cameronmacleod.com/blog/how-does-shazam-work

Audio is a bit easier to turn into a fingerprint for identification vs video. Video has a lot of smaller subtle changes that happen from things like compression which make it a lot harder to identify. It's why youtube still hasn't figured out piracy, but they'll knock you immediately if you play 5 seconds of copyrighted music.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#63

Post by joering2 »

gnomesteel wrote: post #54
androiddrew wrote: post #47

How can we lock down a TV, still use it but trust we aren't being spied on?

Don’t give your TV internet access, and use an Apple TV.

There it is. Not a single TV at my house ever seen a WiFi password. I add cheap Amazon FireStick and be done. Sure Amazon also spies on me but as far as I know original FireStick does not have built-in microphone and probably is not scanning/copying my LAN content to some cloud/back home. And at any time I can just throw it in the trash, get another $29 device. Once I/you plug WiFi password to your TV, there is now way of coming back.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#64

Post by germandiago »

mitxela wrote: post #14
zoobab wrote: post #8

GDPR is forcing them to detail which private data they collect.

The US agreement says it too. They make you agree to them collecting it. It says they listen to everything that's said in the vicinity and you agree to inform any guests to your house that they're being recorded at all times. But nobody reads that.

I find deeply stupid to buy a tv that can potentially spy you but I am pretty sure they do it with phones also...

Every day I want to keep tech more fenced and far from me and only use it for what I need.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#65

Post by dd8601fn »

klausa wrote: post #19
seanieb wrote: post #9

The only reason TV’s are getting cheaper is the business model changed. Now your viewing data (and perhaps conversations) are part of their product offering.

This is just straight up false. OLED productions costs have fallen, and the yields have gotten better — displays of all kinds have gotten cheaper, not just TVs; OLEDs have started showing up in products they haven’t before for cost reasons, etc. The manufacturers make some profit on the data they harvest, sure; but the biggest BOM costs of TVs have definitely also dropped sharply.

The margin on tvs is slim.

Companies like Vizio make vastly more on the ads and data than they do on the tvs.

Some quarters they even take a loss. They took a $7m bath on hardware while booking about $120m on ads and data.

We’re never getting good tv’s back. It’s only going to get worse. Now they’re starting in on monitors.

The only lifeline would be consumer protection, which obviously won’t happen in the US.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#66

Post by caymanjim »

cogman10 wrote: post #48
caymanjim wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure if any TVs currently do this, but they could connect to unsecured public WiFi without the user doing anything, if one were available with no password. Fortunately such networks aren't that common most places, but it's not a big leap from the sketchy things LG and other companies do. They could also put SIMs in them if they wanted. Again, I don't know that any do that, but I wouldn't put it past them. I'm…

I'm not sure of the current state of it, but a few years back specturm was selling access to a private network based on consumer routers. Tmobile could partner with them so that one of their customers could go through spectrum instead of the cell towers in cases where connections were spotty. That's exactly the sort of thing I could see LG piggy backing on. Your neighbor might have spectrum so the LG TV connects to i…

Xfinity/Comcast does the same thing. By default, the router they provide has a separate WiFi network supporting their distributed WiFi service. It's only for their customers, and it's not an open no-password network, but I'm certain they would offer it to any company that paid for access. They also have WiFi APs on telephone poles to broaden coverage.

If you live in a dense city, there's a good chance you can reach an open network. When I lived in midtown Manhattan, there were around 500 SSIDs reachable from my apartment.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#67

Post by jimt1234 »

runjake wrote: post #52

> "LG also said that its features like “Automatic Content Recognition (ACR), voice recognition, and interest-based advertising are optional,” and “not enabled by default.” I am absolutely certain that ACR was enabled on our new TV by default, back some years ago. I am nearly certain their voice recognition, and advertising spying were enabled on our TV by default. If none of this is truly "enabled by default" then th…

A few months ago, my Roku TV started displaying these weird popups, saying something like, "Looks like you're watching college basketball. Did you know Roku-TV also has college basketball?" - something like that. Well, for the Roku device, yes, there was a setting I could disable, but (1) Roku pushed this 'feature' and made it default without my knowledge/consent, and (2) the config setting says the popups will stop, but it doesn't mention the data collection; my assumption is they're still collecting that data for their own data analytics purposes.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#68

Post by newsoftheday »

gnomesteel wrote: post #54
androiddrew wrote: post #47

How can we lock down a TV, still use it but trust we aren't being spied on?

Don’t give your TV internet access, and use an Apple TV.

We do that but use a Kubuntu Linux laptop behind the TV and a wireless mouse and keyboard (when we want to pause a movie in Chrome and search for something, like details about an actor in a movie).

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#70

Post by [deleted] »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

[deleted]
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