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Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

bbc.com

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Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#581

Post by ahartmetz »

LorenPechtel wrote: post #544
mikem170 wrote: post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just to be clear: the current situation is a huge mess caused by one deranged leader. Agreed. The situation is worse than before the U.S. attack. Iran has proven they can control the straight, threatening the world's energy supply. This is a more powerful weapon than a nuke (which multiple agencies, including U.S. intel, said they didn't have when this all started). New leadership in Iran is more galvanized against…

And you're getting downvoted because the truth is too unpleasant. Everyone else realized that the world wasn't ready for anything but appeasement, our idiot didn't understand and pushed it into open conflict. Didn't change the basic situation, though.

Trump sure is an idiot, but it seems somewhat likely that Netanyahu pressured him to perform this particular idiocy that is also against his previous anti-war attitude - one of the few things that was good about his first term.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#582

Post by consumer451 »

IAmBroom wrote: post #506
klaff wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China is also reducing gasoline and diesel use by adoption of EVs.

A slow, ongoing reaction is not going to fix a sudden, large action.

20+ years of preparation does a pretty good job though.

I often wonder about the world we would live in if the Brooks Brothers Riot had not succeeded. That appears to have been the turning point for the fall of the USA, and even more sadly, humanity.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#583

Post by chokolad »

qlte wrote: post #400
nwellnhof wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons Ukraine never had nuclear weapons. Russia is the sole legal successor of the USSR and these were all Russian nukes on Ukrainian territory. > in exchange for peace from Russia There isn't a single mention of nuclear weapons in the Budapest Memorandum.

This is over simplified to the point of being misleading/wrong. Russia was the legal successor of the USSR for purposes of diplomatic continuity, but the other Soviet successor states divided portions of the Soviet military/equipment, split Soviet debt obligations, etc on a case by case basis.

> split Soviet debt obligations, etc on a case by case basis.

What split of Soviet debt obligations? Russia took over all Soviet foreign debt, as well as all the foreign assets

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#584

Post by saturn8601 »

fnordpiglet wrote: post #166
toyg wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody cares about everyday Americans, it's about American corporations . Exxon and friends are printing money.

I have a suspicion that the caring is starting to mount, otherwise there’s no need to offer a $1.3T election bribe (which I’ll file a the other dividend / bribes that were never sent and the bridge Trump sold me)

Thats just the weekly circus. If Dems win everything this election, the next circus will be months of impeachment inquiries followed by no action.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#585

Post by mmooss »

ericmay wrote: post #562
mmooss wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> India and Pakistan both rushed their programs back in the 40s/50s India worked on them on and off for decades and first tested one in 1998, and IIRC Pakistan matched them soon after. North Korea was in the 2000s. > So when you sort of set aside countries from prior to, idk, 1980s ish you don't really have anyone at least publicly (to your point) pursuing nuclear weapons. I'm not going through the comment correcting…

> I'm not going through the comment correcting all of it. Yea, why bother when you're peddling misinformation? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smiling_Buddha > North Korea was in the 2000s. Yes supported by Russia and China they got the keys they needed for the delivery mechanism (ballistic missiles). But the problem with North Korea is they threatened to kill hundreds of thousands of people in South Korea if anyone st…

These are well-known, non-controversial facts.

For anyone unfamiliar with the topic, I encourage them to lookup when India, Pakistan, and North Korea developed nuclear weapons - you will find the answers in an instant.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#586

Post by InsideOutSanta »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #412
autoexec wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that's true, it's insane that it worked. It should be obvious to not take orders from twitter. There's a chain of command for a reason and random people on social media are no part of it. Sounds like the opposition forces would have to be so stupid that any number of Looney Tunes style tricks would have worked. Maybe next they can send out a rabbit in a dress to make opposition fall in love with it.

Yep, the Commander In Chief only issues orders on Truth Social.

I just realized how much money one could make by hacking Truth Social and posting some "truths" under Trump's account. It's a relatively new, relatively complex platform; surely there are bugs.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#587

Post by 0xbadcafebee »

AnotherGoodName wrote: post #118
softwaredoug wrote: post #97

My understanding is we haven’t gotten to full Hormuz apocalypse mode because the Chinese have a ton of stockpiles. And the Red Sea has been an option. Those conditions seem to be changing.

The Houthis also explicitly allow Chinese vessels and Chinese ships have been able to traverse the red sea without issue. Which means China actually has more ability to access oil than other countries right now. I suspect the Chinese won’t be happy with the pipeline and refinery attacks on Saudi Arabia but i also assume that there will still be plenty of Chinese bound oil for the foreseeable future.

China has a backdoor for oil from Russia and Iran (https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/the-ax...) which is part of what feeds their massive reserves. Russia and Iran have an interest in continuing this trade since they're sanctioned by the US and most crude is priced in USD. It's not a major source of their oil due to threats of sanctions from the US, but in a pinch they can ramp it up if needed.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#588

Post by ericmay »

mmooss wrote: post #585
ericmay wrote: post #562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not going through the comment correcting all of it. Yea, why bother when you're peddling misinformation? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smiling_Buddha > North Korea was in the 2000s. Yes supported by Russia and China they got the keys they needed for the delivery mechanism (ballistic missiles). But the problem with North Korea is they threatened to kill hundreds of thousands of people in South Korea if anyone st…

These are well-known, non-controversial facts. For anyone unfamiliar with the topic, I encourage them to lookup when India, Pakistan, and North Korea developed nuclear weapons - you will find the answers in an instant.

> These are well-known, non-controversial facts.

Yes, like India successfully tested their first nuclear weapon in 1974, not 1998 like you are asserting.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#589

Post by ericmay »

goatlover wrote: post #575
ericmay wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nuclear weapons are a special case though. Plus Ukraine didn't have the ability to use them anyway without launch codes as far as I'm aware.

Electronic components can be swapped out. The nuclear material is what really matters.

The ability to fire the weapon matters too. You need a delivery mechanism.

Re: Houthis 'take control' of key island in global shipping route

#590

Post by mmooss »

ericmay wrote: post #566
mmooss wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Iran probably wasn't following the JCPOA When are you talking about and what is that based on? It was the US that withdrew; the other countries continued. US intelligence concluded that Iran had no nuclear weapons program (or maybe, no active one; I don't recall). > you'd also have to say you 100% trust American intelligence to verify Nope, the plan was for the IEA to do their thing with on-the-ground inspectors, s…

> When are you talking about and what is that based on? It was the US that withdrew; the other countries continued. US intelligence concluded that Iran had no nuclear weapons program (or maybe, no active one; I don't recall). They'd just move the research to clandestine or military facilities. They're not stupid. Countries like Iran know how to play these games and they use our own legal mechanisms against us all the…

It's not based on anything, then.

> we shouldn't have to have a JCPOA in the first place, they can just not pursue nuclear weapons like almost every other country on the planet.

Other countries do pursue and have nuclear weapons. Iran has not yet created a full nuclear weapons program - or hadn't before the current war.

Iran, being under constant threat from the US and Israel, with open calls to attack Iran for decades; seeing two neighbors recently deposed by the US (Iraq and Afghanistan); and having had their own government deposed and replaced by a US-friendly one (Mosaddegh in 1953); under constant threat from neighbors and the region (Iraq invaded in the 1980s, Saudi Arabia and other Sunni states are open enemies, Israel of course); may believe that they need nuclear weapons to survive.

Is there another country in a similar position, with the resources to develop nuclear weapons, that doesn't have them? North Korea and Israel both made that choice in similar circumstances.

The US 'nuclear umbrella' covers its allies around the world, a very effective non-proliferation tool. Otherwise, I imagine South Korea, Japan, many NATO countries would build them - there is already discussion of it in the former two countries.

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