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Claude is only available to people over 18 years

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Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#431

Post by lukeschlather »

LadyCailin wrote: post #200
hgoel wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the concern is a forced bit of functionality in all operating systems. It would quickly lead to a "and you need a license to sell your device so we can check that it can't bypass mandatory chuld-safety guards". Just like how some politicians are proposing mandatory licensing for releasing any AI model.

You need licenses for a lot of things though, particularly for things where there is substantial harm to be done when done incorrectly. This is just how it goes as things get more popular. Think back to 1903, there was no FAA then, but also no need for one. But it would be super disingenuous to argue now that airspace should be totally unregulated. I think the problem with this debate in general is that people aren’t…

I think you aren't recognizing the harm of collecting this information. I might be okay with this if companies were banned from using age for targeted advertising.

However, the other harm is the recent IDScan hack which leaked 153M people's IDs. And regulation is not a solution here, we don't know how to implement a regulatory regime that will prevent these sorts of privacy disasters. Even if IDScan gets fines which kill the company (and I suspect they will not) it's not enough of a deterrent because no one will pay enough to actually provide proper security here.

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#432

Post by [deleted] »

londons_explore wrote: post #421
egorfine wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or a boolean value "yes this person is over 18" It would be detrimental to the cause, which is to collect everyone's ID.

Whilst this is OP's point, the reality is the majority of big tech companies have been treating user data like radioactive waste for 10+ years. Most user data is of minimal economic value, until you leak it, and then suddenly there are millions of euros of fines headed your way. Better to not hold the data in the first place.

[deleted]

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#433

Post by LoganDark »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #403
itintheory wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, I'm not a fan of the ID check or identity/age verification. I'm just trying to understand the conspiracy theory kind of idea that "they're trying to get all our IDs!!!1!!" sentiment.

"The government already has our IDs" is missing the correlation between the ID and the service. They know your face and your name but not what you do on the internet. The website knows what you do on the internet but it isn't tied to your name. It's the tying them together which is the problem. Which is why the people trying to do it always pull out the misdirect about ZK proofs. Those don't fix anything because a sy…

It's not possible to prove the user is anything ever. It probably never will be. Likely what will happen instead is that the person in the ID will become personally liable for accounts verified with that ID. Which is even more reason to reject ID verification.

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#434

Post by tt24 »

officeplant wrote: post #230
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly why people turn to AI, which I think is good enough for "casual" mental health advice (the kind people can do themselves by reading self-help books or talking with empathic friends). Arguably it's safer than talking to strangers online because now that they've been doing it for a few years, they will (or should) have plenty of safeguards, unlike people on the internet who can talk out of their ass (like me!)…

>In theory the LLM will escalate or recommend professional help if they're out of their depth. Given there have been multiple suicides driven by LLMs. I really doubt that.

Fascinating perspective - any technology that has caused >0 deaths is a dead end and has no chance of improvement.

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#436

Post by tt24 »

miki123211 wrote: post #171
hobofan wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd wager it's more due to decision making culpability. Now, for the next "teen committed suicide after talking to AI therapist" headline, Claude can deflect the blame to the parents for not supervising their child enough.

If you have an ineffective system for preventing a thing from happening, but one where the "victim" has to override the system, the victim is at fault. Your honor, the user manual in the box did say "don't put children in the microwave."

So in your example a microwave company should be held liable if someone puts a child in a microwave?

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#437

Post by chrisjj »

whazor wrote: post #83

I can understand the concerns but at the same time it feels weird to deny young people the ability to make their ideas reality. I got proper internet access when I was 12 and that is how I taught myself how to program.

> ... at the same time it feels weird to deny young people the ability to make their ideas reality.

I'd not realised the ban covers child brains too. /i

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#438

Post by shevy-java »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #119
embedding-shape wrote: post #33

Claude Executive: Damn, we hardly know who our users are, can't we just force them to say their full name or ban them? Claude Product Manager: No, that'll piss people off too much, and sadly we can't just ask for ID either... Claude Executive: There must be some way we can force people to link their government IDs with our platform so our analytics get better and more accurate? Claude Product Manager: We could limit…

Age verification is not (should not be) the same as ID verification / storage / etc; the US needs laws similar to EU ones where companies can only get the minimum required PII. In the case of age verification that's zero, or a boolean value "yes this person is over 18" that they get from a trusted party like a bank.

I do not want my computer to yield information to evil outside actors in general. This is why systemd going that way is so outrageous:

https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/40954

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#439

Post by shevy-java »

londons_explore wrote: post #421
egorfine wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or a boolean value "yes this person is over 18" It would be detrimental to the cause, which is to collect everyone's ID.

Whilst this is OP's point, the reality is the majority of big tech companies have been treating user data like radioactive waste for 10+ years. Most user data is of minimal economic value, until you leak it, and then suddenly there are millions of euros of fines headed your way. Better to not hold the data in the first place.

But then why do they want to sniff after everyone?

Storing all that information is cheap nowadays. Any state agency may be happy to get more information about The People.

Re: Claude is only available to people over 18 years

#440

Post by jonas21 »

embedding-shape wrote: post #33

Claude Executive: Damn, we hardly know who our users are, can't we just force them to say their full name or ban them? Claude Product Manager: No, that'll piss people off too much, and sadly we can't just ask for ID either... Claude Executive: There must be some way we can force people to link their government IDs with our platform so our analytics get better and more accurate? Claude Product Manager: We could limit…

More likely, this is being done to comply with SB 1119 (Adam's Law) [1,2] and similar legislation. These create extra steps that a service has to go through before releasing a new model that minors can interact with and exposes them to prosecution if a minor is harmed or harms someone else due to their interaction with a chatbot. It's safer for Anthropic to just exclude minors -- and they're unlikely to be paying customers anyway.

[1] https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...

[2] https://sd18.senate.ca.gov/news/governor-newsom-signs-adams-...

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