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Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

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Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#591

Post by ifwinterco »

Gareth321 wrote: post #544
johnfn wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a biker, I've had human drivers intentionally try to drive me off the road or hit me. Neither driver education nor higher test standards will solve that problem.

I've been following Tesla communities and a common response to using FSD is that it makes people nicer drivers. Thousands of people admitting that they can be angry drivers. That they get frustrated in traffic and can take risks or be aggressive on the road. With FSD they almost universally claim to be calmer, care less about being cut off, and almost never experience road rage.

Best way to improve the behaviour of other drivers (at least in the UK): drive a van, ideally an unmarked one with a couple of dents already.

Miraculously everyone else suddenly learns how to drive and doesn't try anything stupid

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#592

Post by asdff »

WalterBright wrote: post #59

I'll be sad when I'm forced to give up driving my old cars.

The loss of the joy and satisfaction of driving a proper drivers car with a firm feeling manual transmission will be hard to explain to future generations for sure.

But the bigger fear is the loss of autonomy in movement that having everyone become beholden to a botnet for transportation will bring.

"Drive me to the anti government protest. I want to make my voice heard."

"I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that."

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#594

Post by dkdbejwi383 »

giantg2 wrote: post #234

Better driver education and higher test standards would save lives too. So would banning alcohol. None of these solutions, including automated cars, will be mandated any time soon. It's not enough to have data, you also have to have societal buy-in. Interesting that Waymo chooses to compare accident rates with the average driver vs the rideshare drivers their cars replace. The numbers wouldn't look as impressive beca…

Enforcement, too, including the little things that "don't really matter". Letting people get away with minor infringements like parking where it's forbidden, idling with the engine running, close passes etc means the window of what's acceptable driving behaviour shifts.

We should return to the idea that driving is a privilege, not a right.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#595

Post by deviance »

dkdbejwi383 wrote: post #594
giantg2 wrote: post #234

Better driver education and higher test standards would save lives too. So would banning alcohol. None of these solutions, including automated cars, will be mandated any time soon. It's not enough to have data, you also have to have societal buy-in. Interesting that Waymo chooses to compare accident rates with the average driver vs the rideshare drivers their cars replace. The numbers wouldn't look as impressive beca…

Enforcement, too, including the little things that "don't really matter". Letting people get away with minor infringements like parking where it's forbidden, idling with the engine running, close passes etc means the window of what's acceptable driving behaviour shifts. We should return to the idea that driving is a privilege, not a right.

[flagged]

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#596

Post by tossandthrow »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #493
cbondurant wrote: post #125

I'd much rather all of the resources that are going into autonomous cars was instead going into proper public transit infrastructure. Cars are so hopelessly space and energy inefficient, and I hate driving them. If I could get around by bus, light rail, bike, and all of the wasted city space devoted to parking could be turned into more housing and amenities, that would be great. I think it would be meaningful to also…

People always say this, but a) even countries known for good transit like Japan still have a ton of cars for various things, and b) there's no getting around that the money going into self-driving cars vs public transit isn't something that can really be swapped. It's coming from a different place for a different reason. We absolutely could invest into more trains even with the SDC money flowing anyway, it's not like…

A better idea would just be to let drivers pay the real price for the infrastructure they occupy and their negative externalities.

Then people would likely not have a issue with public transit.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#597

Post by sensanaty »

PorciiVorbesc wrote: post #246
sensanaty wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always invest in actual public transport & sane infrastructure, rather than relying on clogging the streets up with more cars, autonomous or otherwise? My mother-in-law is in a wheelchair and zooms by on the bike paths faster than I do thanks to her handbike (it's seriously insane how fast people can move with handbikes), and if she needs to travel large distances she hops onto a train instead. The best par…

>You could always invest in actual public transport & sane infrastructure, rather than relying on clogging the streets up with more cars, autonomous or otherwise So what should the disabled people do until that amazing public transport infrastructure materializes, if it ever even does for them at all? Sit at home and wait? I dislike this type of patronizing superficial handweaving advice that is disconnected from the…

This is just learned helplessness. The US already spends unfathomable amounts of money and resources on car infra, and there's always some nonsensical defense like "it's just impossible to do it any other way!", as if cars are simply a law of nature. That lack of money can be solved by diverting some of the money going into roads into instead improving public transport infra.

The solution should NOT be investing in driverless cars, which are all owned by megacorps and leave people shackled to Google and Elon Musk.

You even mentioned another cliche, Geography, but then right below mention Switzerland. Same goes for NIMBYism and everything else you mentioned, how come these aren't issues when building massive 12 lane highways, but adding some dedicated bike paths suddenly turns into a quagmire that rivals the Manhattan Project in scale and difficulty?

Utrecht in the Netherlands is a perfect example of reversing course on car-centric designs. They had a canal, emptied it out to build a massive highway, then realized "hey, that's idiotic!" And turned it back into a canal and banned cars from the area completely. It's now a gorgeous city center free of cars, plentiful public transport options, accessible to wheelchair users and kids and literally everyone.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#598

Post by himinlomax »

robner wrote: post #360
socalgal2 wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my circle, everyone who's tried Waymo never wants to use Uber/Lyft with a human driver again. And, many of them wish they could own one or at least use one for much longer drives (100s of miles). I would visit my mom (2hrs by car) more often if that 2hrs (each way) wasn't so stressful and exhausting and I could just be chauffeured by a self driving car while I browse the net, play a game, watch a movie, or talk to…

In the Netherlands were I live we use trains for this

A 2h train ride is not a problem, but what is is the trip to and from the stations.

A 2h autonomous car ride removes that entirely.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#599

Post by dkdbejwi383 »

deviance wrote: post #595
dkdbejwi383 wrote: post #594

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enforcement, too, including the little things that "don't really matter". Letting people get away with minor infringements like parking where it's forbidden, idling with the engine running, close passes etc means the window of what's acceptable driving behaviour shifts. We should return to the idea that driving is a privilege, not a right.

[flagged]

What a strange thing to say

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#600

Post by win311fwg »

Zambyte wrote: post #435
SEJeff wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is ~263x larger than the Netherlands landmass wise. It would require a loooot more trains than we have or you have.

Now do China.

Technically a large landmass, but essentially nothing happens in the western half. For the sake of travel it is a relatively small country. Whereas NY->LA is the route the USA would need to most service if it were to get serious about such a thing. The short-run corridors are already reasonably well serviced.

Trouble is most people doing the NY->LA run are going to choose flight instead.

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