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Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

nytimes.com

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Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#51

Post by SoftTalker »

bugbull wrote: post #47
hombre_fatal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t imagine how many shortcuts I would have taken as a kid/teen or stressed uni student if AI were an option. I can see even a well-meaning student stuck in this aspirational cycle of “I’ll do it myself next time, but right now I just want to catch up.”

There were certainly integral solving validators online when I took calculus in high school. At some point I gave up and just used that, because “the money is in web application development, I don’t need that calculus stuff”. Big regret. Edit: For reference, the regret came when I tried to do some RF related projects on the side. Those projects would likely have gone somewhere if I put some effort into even the basic…

I have never needed calculus since leaving university, nearly 40 year ago. If you're not in hard engineering, you probably won't (and if you are, you'll get to use all the computer assisting tools you want).

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#53

Post by voxl »

rps93 wrote: post #34
legitster wrote: post #26

Even if you're pro-AI, there's a reason calculators are banned from math classes until a certain point. It seems like a no-brainer to have people learn on hammers before moving them to nailguns. I can't help but think of this Chesterton Quote: "It is, on the contrary, a thing analogous to writing one's own love-letters or blowing one's own nose. These things we want a man to do for himself, even if he does them badly…

Im for this as I use AI in my current college classes to learn things quickly. Also, save money aka not have to buy/read the textbook. Using AI allows me to take and feed my notes to it and have it create multiple choice quizzes. Same for assignments where my teacher asks us to define terms. So far doing this I am able to retain things quickly and speak intelligently during the next class. So dont read the textbook,…

So you'd rather give money to the company that stole the copyrighted material of experts and academics instead of giving them money? Sure some textbooks are corporate greed schemes themselves, but many others are just the work of a group of professors

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#54

Post by Zetaphor »

charcircuit wrote: post #39
legitster wrote: post #26

Even if you're pro-AI, there's a reason calculators are banned from math classes until a certain point. It seems like a no-brainer to have people learn on hammers before moving them to nailguns. I can't help but think of this Chesterton Quote: "It is, on the contrary, a thing analogous to writing one's own love-letters or blowing one's own nose. These things we want a man to do for himself, even if he does them badly…

It's like banning teachers or textbooks from school. LLMs are the single greatest learning technology ever created.

Saying that a human teacher is equivalent to an LLM is derogatory to the teachers and exaggerating the capabilities of the LLM. I say this as someone who uses these things daily in my work and personal life. Let's not murky the waters with complete falsehoods

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#56

Post by protimewaster »

anonymars wrote: post #43
protimewaster wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's limited to "younger students", and keeping younger students away from computers also isn't a bad idea IMO.

I think young exposure to real computers (where you create, and have to figure things out; not consumption machines) provides access to a level of fluency that is otherwise difficult or impossible to achieve, just like many other skills (language, music...)

I think that can be done without having them sit in front of a computer or even really using a computer, though. Lots of kids have stories about wandering over to a college campus when they were in middle school, wandering into a room with the keypunch machines, and learning about computers that way. Very few of those kids directly used a computer, but they learned it anyway.

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#57

Post by jjk166 »

nekiwo wrote: post #23
kolinko wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Current chatbots are better tutors than an average school teacher imho. Not saying that we should replace ones with the other ones, but I’d say from age 11-12 and up kids should be taught how to use AI well.

Communicating with adults and handling the friction of conversing with others is a skill students need to gain, especially at this age. Talking to a machine that will always suit your style of talking isn't always good.

The purpose of a teacher is not to be a challenging conversational partner.

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#58

Post by SoftTalker »

anonymars wrote: post #43
protimewaster wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's limited to "younger students", and keeping younger students away from computers also isn't a bad idea IMO.

I think young exposure to real computers (where you create, and have to figure things out; not consumption machines) provides access to a level of fluency that is otherwise difficult or impossible to achieve, just like many other skills (language, music...)

So give your kid an Apple-II or TRS-80 then?

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#59

Post by baby_souffle »

mushi_shi wrote: post #41
charcircuit wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's like banning teachers or textbooks from school. LLMs are the single greatest learning technology ever created.

Are you sure that taking shortcuts to information isn't potentially doing more damage to learning?

Being able to access information faster is not really a problem. I don't know anybody that was super upset that the encyclopedia came on a bunch of CD roms instead of bound volumes.

Not having the skills to assess the accuracy / validity of the information you accessed at breakneck speed however is going to be the downfall of us all.

Ai just made it easier to generate misinformation faster. We were already suffering from the blight of misinformation spreading through various media channels.

If AI can be used to better teach effective media and information literacy, we should be rolling that out in schools.

But it sounds like AI in public schools is largely just being used for speed running homework.

Re: Mamdani bans AI in NYC schools

#60

Post by Sebguer »

voxl wrote: post #53
rps93 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im for this as I use AI in my current college classes to learn things quickly. Also, save money aka not have to buy/read the textbook. Using AI allows me to take and feed my notes to it and have it create multiple choice quizzes. Same for assignments where my teacher asks us to define terms. So far doing this I am able to retain things quickly and speak intelligently during the next class. So dont read the textbook,…

So you'd rather give money to the company that stole the copyrighted material of experts and academics instead of giving them money? Sure some textbooks are corporate greed schemes themselves, but many others are just the work of a group of professors

they literally said that they think Mamdani is doing the right thing and that they understand they're hindering their education by using AI the way they are, did you even read the comment before making your response?
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