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CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

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Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What does a CEO(and other managers) do really? Take risk with other people's lives and earn the big bucks for that.

If you were legitimately suddenly saddled with the responsibilities of a typical ‘CEO’, chances are you’d shit your britches within a month. Part of a CEO’s job is to be the target of all warranted and unwarranted blame for every single bad thing that anyone in the organisation experiences, even the inherent/inevitable ones, even the ones that others in the organisation see as a good thing. Me. Not a CEO, and no desi…

Exactly, as also evidenced by the guy who was brutally murdered just because he was the CEO of a company someone had an axe to grind against.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#492

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to this executive survey, the average time spent for board duties for public companies is well over 242 hours per year: https://www.spencerstuart.com/research-and-insight/spencer-s... So that would be like if I took 6 work weeks weeks off per year to work full time at some other company.

I'm not sure I trust any self-reported numbers on this kind of stuff. 10 - 20 days per year (but not evenly distributed) is a common figure I see thrown around: https://www.nedcapital.co.uk/how-much-time-does-a-non-execut...

10-20 days a year is in the same ballpark and is still a lot. I quoted 6 work weeks (40 hours per day at 5 days per week) which is 30 days a year, not that much higher than your stated 10-20 days.

The article I linked specifically mentioned that private company boards demand less time than public company boards, around 200 hours, roughly 25 work days.

Any of these figures is pretty close to my entire yearly PTO allocation as an individual contributor.

Nike consistently has 5 board meetings per year, so Tim Cook is taking time out of running the second most valuable company in the world to do that, for some reason.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#493

A serious point about this is that it's an AI that's an organization. This matters. People laughed at Gas Town, and at that "Fences, not Sandboxes" article yesterday.[1] They're both AIs set up as an organization, not an emulated human. They're both expensive to operate, because the AI members of the organization spend a lot of time talking with each other. They're both applied to frivolous problems. Now we have the…

We have some interesting evidence from AI agents. People used to make the plan with a stronger and more expensive model, and then use a cheaper model to do the "grunt work" of implementing it. But it turns out it's better to do it the other way around. A good plan is easy, implementing it is not.

Hard disagree. Both planning and implementation are hard in many codebases, mine included, and cheaper models will fuck up either one if allowed to.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#494
post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Understand human nature, incentives, and complex systems like markets and how they produce incentives. We do. "Class war" is just the succinct phrasing for "people who earn money through capital returns have vastly different incentives than people who earn money from their labor, and they also have the means to turn those interests into political leverage".

Except that when you comparison shop, you are helping construct those incentives.

When you sell your labor you want it to cost as much as possible. When you buy the results of others labor you want them to be as cheap as possible.

The system is circles, cycles, loops, two sided trades. It’s not one group of people unilaterally plotting things. When someone does try to do that they usually fail unless their plot happens to align with the current in the river.

If you get rid of the investment and capital class you will get a new investment and capital class, probably made up of the leaders of the revolution that overthrew the old one. That’s where our current one came from after all. They are the intellectual and social descendants of the mercantile capitalists who overthrew the feudal order.

It’s pretty common for the new boss to end up becoming the old boss because they are also monkeys with the same limbic system.

Real change would require changing the system not the people in it, but I see no ideas on how to do this from the typical pop Marxist at least. Maybe there are deeper thinkers out there. Usually it’s “proletarian revolution, magic happens here, utopia.” Instead you get a new capital class whose power is rooted in position in the party, like the CCP, and it behaves just like our capital class.

I also suspect really deep change would require genetic modification that alters the structure of the human central nervous system, since a lot of this stuff is just ape behavior writ large.

My deeper point is: there’s a lot of discontent out there for legitimate reasons, but I don’t think LARPing communism will help any more than LARPing fascism has. We need new ideas, not 19th century ones that failed. Right now it just feels like the only ideas we have is to LARP the 1930s.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#495
post #181

A serious point about this is that it's an AI that's an organization. This matters. People laughed at Gas Town, and at that "Fences, not Sandboxes" article yesterday.[1] They're both AIs set up as an organization, not an emulated human. They're both expensive to operate, because the AI members of the organization spend a lot of time talking with each other. They're both applied to frivolous problems. Now we have the…

A related point that I've been making privately for at least ten years to anyone that would listen, is that we've had Superhuman Intelligence for at least hundreds, if not thousands, of years in the form of corporations and institutions. No single human could design a rocket to go to the moon or keep all Wallmart stores supplied on a daily basis. Moreover when something like the CEO or US president changes, the polic…

Oh my friend your imagination is limited!

The entire financial system is a form of artificial intelligence. We just never framed it that way.

It only shocks humans now because they a) never thought about it - it was in the background b) it’s in your face and you can play with it

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

he didn't say "everything" he said one thing.

In my experience, these class warfare conspiracists see class warfare in everything. Everything in human society gets reduced down to one side is the oppressor and one side is the victim. And they’re always the victim. EDIT since I can’t reply: It’s true that capital and labor often have competing goals, but they also have alignment at times. And labor also has different goals from consumers, from other groups of lab…

Surely everything economy related where the capital owners want one thing and the wage workers wants another is clearly a class war.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

he didn't say "everything" he said one thing.

In my experience, these class warfare conspiracists see class warfare in everything. Everything in human society gets reduced down to one side is the oppressor and one side is the victim. And they’re always the victim. EDIT since I can’t reply: It’s true that capital and labor often have competing goals, but they also have alignment at times. And labor also has different goals from consumers, from other groups of lab…

> conspiracists

You denialists have one favorite go-to rebuttal, don't you?

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#498
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And we haven't solved "alignment" for corporations either...

I've made that point before. From an "alignment" perspective, AIs and corporations have many of the same problems. Corporations, according to Milton Friedman, have the sole duty of increasing their profits.[1] This is a key document in the history of modern conservatism.[2] So what happens when AIs are "aligned" purely to corporate goals? This is a nearer term worry than machines taking over for the benefit of machin…

To be clear it is to maximize the wealth of the owners.

You can maximize profits whilst destroying value btw.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But why would you do that? Because that is what actually gets pursued. The set of effective goals an organization is distinctly different from those of any of the individuals in that organization.

You're missing what I'm trying to say. There are no goals in nature. Agency and goal-directedness is something we ascribe to things. The set of things an organization ends up doing may be distinctly different from those of the individuals, but that does in no way oblige us to ascribe agency to the organization on its own.

Yes there are - the goal is to survive. This is hard coded into any entity.

What’s the primary goal of any for profit business? To survive for eternity - going concern in perpetuity that is hopefully very valuable.

Re: CEO fired developers to make room for AI. Developers create open source AI CEO

#500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can be the best at bringing in shareholder value, which would have a great correlation with enshittification. Having the ability to reduce the quality of something so that customers barely stay (or have no where else to go because they have been trapped in a monopoly or a walled garden) is not a skill. I'd argue it is a trait out of cartoon villains.

We watched very different cartoons.

Scooby-Doo > * when it comes to accurately depicting the predictable nature of capitalist villainy.
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