It is only a matter of time before this administration does this to green card applications and renewals too. A permanent green card is not permanent. It needs to be renewed every 10 years. I am also worried about policies eventually directed at naturalized citizens. I sincerely hope I am wrong.
U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
841–850 of 1001 posts
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#842Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean this in the best possible spirit, but if it does seem intentionally inflammatory, then I think it's mostly a result of your political priors. The 4th top reply on this submission is: "the current admin are working hard to destroy the U.S as if they're foreign agents." If I were a less patient man I would also find this inflammatory, but I know the person saying it just says it because they genuinely believe it…
I think claiming that this policy is broadly harmful to the US economy is more factually grounded than claiming its a "generational W."
Good for the economy is not the same as good, bad for the economy is not the same as bad. Sometimes good things can still be bad for the economy, like outlawing child labour or slavery.
That being said, I don't think there is any evidence that survives scrutiny that immigration has been a net positive for any western country, and if I take Norway as a specific example, we have good data that immigration has been a net negative [1]. And furthermore we have the peculiar problem that whenever a statistic does show that immigration has a net negative effect in Norway, that the government rapidly stops collecting the statistic as a mere coincidence [2].
I think we could potentially change our immigration policies so that immigration becomes a net positive, but I'm not interested in that. I just want it to stop.
The people who sold mass immigration as being an economic benefit did not actually ever care about the economy, they just thought it's the easiest way to convince people, and they have already pivoted to other reasons for supporting mass immigration because the thing they want is the mass immigration and the resulting consequences.
The people who sold mass immigration on economic grounds also never had any real data behind their claims that it is economically beneficial, and institutions like universities, media, entertainment pushed the unfounded claim uncritically, like good little soldiers, and then retroactively worked as hard as possible to only ever paint it in a positive light and to dismiss negative consequences.
The result in me is a complete distaste for the very idea of immigration. I just want my country back.
[1]: https://www.nettavisen.no/nyheter/her-er-ssb-forsker-holmoys...
[2]: https://www.nettavisen.no/artikkel/alle-overfallsvoldtekter-...
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#843So for those that don't know, it's quite common for a visa renewal to be required to leave the country. Depending on the visa, you might have to do this every year. So just imagine, having a normal job in the US and you're asked to leave to renew your visa and this stuff happens. That's no more appointment, not even a new date and you're now very likely unable to work and possibly can't even enter the country to get…
Not trying to make a political point at all and perhaps a controversial take. But, it’s specifically and maybe implicitly by design. Meaning they made this way precisely so you have to reapply so they can change their mind or block you out later. Nothing about getting a visa is permanent and you’re fully at risk when you move here with that type of status. If you evaluate the situation that’s always been the case.
I can confirm Ireland does this as well. I'm not familiar with immigration law as have both US and EU passports and can travel to work freely between the two.
While I critique the US for a lot and it does get a lot wrong I think many countries do this.
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#844Earlier quoted context omitted.
It most certainly is hypocritical. You can not be simultaneously pro-legal immigration and support banning legal immigration. If you support banning legal immigration, you are by definition anti-legal immigration. > Being anti-illegal immigration and pro-legal immigration doesn't mean you want to flood the country with legal immigrants. If only there were something between 0 and unrestricted immigration, some sort of…
> You can not be simultaneously pro-legal immigration and support banning legal immigration. Nobody is banning legal immigration. It's being restricted. The headline itself says "pauses". Do you think no legal immigrant will be let into the US until 2028? > some sort of program where people apply for permission Yes, and if that program is being abused (just ask people here on HN about H1Bs to see how they feel), then…
> Nobody is banning legal immigration. It's being restricted.
No it has been banned. There is no legal way to do it. Even if it is a temporary ban, it is a ban. If you support indefinitely pausing legal immigration, you are anti-legal immigration.
> Yes, and if that program is being abused (just ask people here on HN about H1Bs to see how they feel), then you pause it until you figure out how to solve it.
That is an absurd strategy. Would you "indefinitely pause" schooling children until you can figure out a way to solve the problem of students cheating on tests? Would you "indefinitely pause" funding police forces until you can figure out how to prevent police abuses? Would you "indefinitely pause" money transfers until you can figure out how to solve tax fraud? Pausing any of these would create massive problems while doing nothing to speed up improvements, and it doesn't help that "solving" those problems may not even be possible. We can immediately switch to a better system after someone figures out that better system; until then we make do with what we have.
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#845Earlier quoted context omitted.
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To equate immigrants who have followed due process to a homeless person insisting on staying in a property owner's living room is appalling. It's understandable for everyone to have varying views on immigration and immigrants, but this sort of rhetoric is a vile, racist and xenophobic dog whistle.
Do you have an argument or do you just want to play leftist thought-terminating slur bingo?
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#846Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why would a person who is supposedly having rare skills come to a country and spend their best years here without reasonable guarantee of permanency? I agree with your overall point but the answer here is money. The earning potential in the US vs. e.g. India is drastic.
Yes but if you are worth that money to any company why would you assume one day it will all just end? That's not typical or normal for most careers
I think that in general, expecting a 'career for life' with one company, as was common in the 1950s, is a bit naive today. Companies change, needs change, people change, just because you like the job now doesn't mean you will in ten years. To give a tech industry example, right now you could be working for a cool startup, in a few years the startup gets acquired by a large tech company, they change the management style, it's not fun anymore. Like imagine you got hired at Github around 2010, would you definitely still be there today? Or even in 2020?
Also, you have plenty of people who will have career plans like "work in finance in NYC for 5-10 years, amass a fat pile of cash, and retire to a small farm in the middle of nowhere". If I were living in China or India, I might see "spending 5-10 years in the US earning large piles of money and returning to my homeland to retire and live a life of leisure" as a valid career path.
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#847Earlier quoted context omitted.
The leaving part is not the issue, as you try to immigrate into a country you're subject to the rules that country sets. You're always free to not immigrate into that country (this is not about asylum). The issue here is that, if you just left the country to do everything the country asked you, you are now in limbo. For how long? No one can tell. Does this mean you lose your job? Maybe. And when you decide it's no lo…
when you treat immigrants like they were not people with lifes, you are just one step away from treating poor people as they were not people and then too treat all common people as they were not people. also it has been quite convenient explanation for adopting systems such as Flock and allowing all kinds of para-police actions which seems very similar to what happened in germany circla 1930-1934
> when you treat immigrants like they were not people with lifes, you are just one step away from treating poor people as they were not people and then too treat all common people as they were not people.
"The way that a society treats its prisoners is one of the sharpest reflections of its character." - Nelson Mandela
http://www.mandela.gov.za/mandela_speeches/1998/980625_dcshr...
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#848Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm an American that lives abroad. I have first-hand experience how other countries treat 'immigrants'. H1B is a temporary non-immigrant visa. I could never imagine myself buying a home in a country where I don't have permanent access to that real estate. I am not opposed to voting to prevent non-PRs from owning real estate in order to keep housing prices lower for residents and prevent non-immigrants from shooting t…
I think one of the fundamental problem with h1b is that it is labeled as "non-immigrant" whereas for all practical purposes it is really an immigrant visa. Why would a person who is supposedly having rare skills come to a country and spend their best years here without reasonable guarantee of permanency? People buy homes because it is a reasonable belief that they are going to be living here permanently and it has hi…
There is a very common pattern of people who go to work to some other, richer country for a set period of time with the sole purpose of making enough money to achieve an objective back home (provide for family, buy a house, retire, etc). I don't know how common this is between H-1B applicants, but it's extremely common in the EU for example.
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#849Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could you explain a bit more? Not sure what is achieved by forcing people to renew their visas from abroad. I appreciate that, philosophically, it is a way of setting requirements higher, but it does not strike me as principled. From my perspective as an immigrant in the UK, there have got to be so many parameters the UK government can adjust before indulging into performative cruelty. Setting higher requirements for…
If the government refuses a visa renewal while the person is in the country and they don’t comply you have to deport them, which is often problematic. If you make it standard procedure that everyone has to leave the country temporarily to renew their visa, the person is already outside your country when you refuse the renewal. Instead of having a deportation challenged in court and mired in paperwork, you simply don’…
This would be true if visa and status were the same thing. In the US, they are not. Whether you are legally present in the US is governed by status. So what happens is that your status is valid and even renewed or extended in the US. But your visa expires. And you need to renew the visa just to bring the date on the visa to the same date as your status. You literally go to the consulate and show them your other status document, and they stamp your passport with the date from the other status document. It's all quite silly. A bit like the movie Brazil.
Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications
#850the current admin are working hard to destroy the U.S as if they're foreign agents. not only are they making it hard & unbearable for families of US citizens & PR holders to be together. while at the same time - discouraging talent to come to the US at a crucial time when talent is at a premium due to A.I development. last the backwards energy policy of banning renewable energy.
This was never about talent. It's about companies hiring foreigners on h1b visas at below market wages where their life in the USA is contingent on their job performance forcing them to work harder and longer than their peers to remain in the country. It's a situation that only benefits companies, while harming US citizens who have to compete with the lower wages of foreigners.
The problem is the H1B visa is a lottery not a points based system. As someone who applied for an H1B 5 times and never got it, despite being highly skilled and having a PhD and a well paying job. The only way in was on an intern visa or an Einstein visa. Insane system