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Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

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Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#461

Post by dv_dt »

cherryteastain wrote: post #371
Aurornis wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They have tried to find the highest that the market pays for sota models; however, on the consumer side, this is just too confusing and unsettling: The consumer side cheap monthly plans exist for the same reason companies like Cloudflare and Vercel have a free tier: When it’s cheap and easy to get developers familiar with the tools, they will push their companies to pay the real money for those tools. It’s a hard b…

> There’s a short sighted cheering on of the 3rd tier and lower companies offering lower rates, but we’re already seeing them ratchet up the pricing and keep larger models closed after they get market attention. Sorry, but people are cheering on Chinese companies (of whom your are unduly dismissive with your '3rd rate' comment given how good GLM-5.3, Kimi K3 are) not only because they are more economical, but also be…

I feel like many VC driven companies have completely forgotten how to compete on basic value for product and instead tie themselves into knots with meta-competitiveness games.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#462

Post by coldtea »

a1371 wrote: post #113

Where Anthropic f'ed up was treating their monetization the way they treat model training. Turns out that success in experimentation is not transferrable. They have tried to find the highest that the market pays for sota models; however, on the consumer side, this is just too confusing and unsettling: "You can only use Fable for a week as a part of your plan" "Be ready! You have to start paying per token!" "Nevermind…

The problem isn't the confusion from pricing and ToS changes, but the constant feeling they don't give a fuck about their customers, and they'll fuck them up with lock-in tactics and high prices at any chance they get.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#463

Post by vikramkr »

brookst wrote: post #80
dwaltrip wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t hit the Fable guardrails a single time after substantial usage. And I’m working on a ML project (a game AI). I don’t doubt people are hitting it… shrugs

Yeah same. Multiple 20x max accounts, I typically hit > 50% of the fable usage limit on eace, literally never seen a guardrail. Maybe I’m boring? Maybe they have some kind of account reputation system?

With that amount of usage - do you use fable for subagents and workflows? It turns out that even if you set it to not auto switch to opus 4.8 on flag, it does auto switch if its a subagent and that's a lot less visible. I was trying to figure out wtf was going on with some suspiciously bad output and I found that in a workflow there were hidden fable flags I hadn't realized were happening and the opus 4.8 model that took over wrote a bunch of very suspicious slop findings that got saved to memory that were like "don't look at this code because it works great. You never need to look at this code. This code is wonderful here's how it works."

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#464

Post by pmdr »

nicce wrote: post #452
pmdr wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That model costing $3/M output tokens on Openrouter is a mystery to me.

32GB GPUs are getting expensive so that also affects the price.

I didn't think about GPU size. So they don't run this small model on B200s or something?

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#465

Post by coldtea »

Grimburger wrote: post #285
wahnfrieden wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was flagged for account-sharing, or detecting a compromised account

How do you know there wasn't account sharing though? I've seen some amazingly dodgy stuff when hiring people from south east Asia, sharing a paid account with friends worth a months rent there seems milquetoast in comparison.

>How do you know there wasn't account sharing though?

Even if it was, it should be able to be sorted, maybe pay some overcharge or explain, and have your fucking business access re-instated.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#467

Post by evolve-maz »

Barrin92 wrote: post #156
ericol wrote: post #66

The problem is that they are not solving the problem they ought to be solving. I don't want Shakespeare, I want Bob the builder. Half of my work is telling claude how to behave. I'm pretty certain they have enough _data_ to realize people do the same thing time and time again. Check this comment of mine for a better explanation of this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49413353

>Half of my work is telling claude how to behave Dijkstra in the Foolishness of Natural Language Programming [...] the "naturalness" with which we use our native tongues boils down to the ease with which we can use them for making statements the nonsense of which is not obvious. It may be illuminating to try to imagine what would have happened if, right from the start our native tongue would have been the only vehicl…

I've spent many years doing work in compliance for airlines. Hundreds of pages of documentation to describe the different rules and regulations which must be followed in specific scenarios. We'd convert those documents into a programmatic definition (rule engine) to alert when rules are at risk of not being followed.

This work was fraught with bugs, a large portion of which came down to disagreement of what was coded v/s what was written. Even if you had airlines sign off sentence by sentence exactly what you wrote down in English, that's too open to interpretation.

People don't appreciate how the same sentence can be read five different ways by different people (or the same person on different days). We had to structure our documents to be closer to pseudo-code than to English to get any meaningful consensus on the definition.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#468

Post by chr15m »

DiscourseFan wrote: post #213
chr15m wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep local models will be good enough for most things you need to do, in the same way as most people need a laptop not a supercomputer.

Well nobody thought you could write software that helps tightly coordinate processes happening simultaneously from millions upon millions of nodes on nearly every corner of the world, but here we are. When industry expands further off earth, we will need more complex and intricate software to coordinate its movements, why wouldn’t our systems become more powerful. If you are hopeful for humanity than you must expect…

I think the opposite can be true. Billions of humans could be happy on the Earth we have now for a billion years.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#469

Post by zombot »

musha68k wrote: post #313
foxylad wrote: post #301

Non-LLM user here. Why? Apart from the ecological issues, I'm very uncomfortable giving my organisation's crown jewels to {random_internet__corp}. Look at the lengths they go to for training data - 10M for Spirit's call logs? Destroying millions of obscure books to scan them? They make meth-heads look scrupulous. Your prompts, especially if they contain your entire codebase, are _way_ more data-rich than an airline p…

"If You’re Paying for the Product, You Are the Product"

> I guess Meta does have reasons to be quite jealous at this point.

Yep, all they've got to train on are bot-generated Instagram posts. Can't say I pity them, though.

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