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AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

economist.com

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Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#301

Post by shimman »

dan_ggggg wrote: post #243
shimman wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely had a sheltered public school experience, took AP stats my senior year and realized all the top students were sharing answers from an earlier period through text messages. After figuring this out I too joined in on the action, then shortly after I quickly deskilled. Suppose it's good to learn how elastic the brain is, in both directions, at a young age where it doesn't matter.

> at a young age where it doesn't matter. Doesn't it matter the most at a young age?

Not really. I would rather not find out later in life, with way more responsibilities, that when you purposely neglect mental skills they atrophy quite fast. People already have a hard time noticing that they age, being able to truly self asses is a skill that few, including myself here, possess.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#302

Post by doctorwho42 »

dan_ggggg wrote: post #268
doctorwho42 wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, concentrating the environmental impact of 20GW of gas based power generation would be the equivalent of 6-9 Million cars running... All in the space of a corner of a small city

That sounds much worse than I had expected. Is this enough consumption to significantly affect the local price of gasoline? Edit: Why don't they have lower-emission power sources?

We do have lower emission alternatives, but not at the cost point... Remember these are corporations trying to make the largest profit possible

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#303

Post by vkou »

sebastiennight wrote: post #276
vkou wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you expect students to learn anything when: 1. They don't do any homework. 2. All the in-class time is split between the teacher babysitting and playing social worker to problem students, and lecturing, with little to no opportunity to actually practice what they've learned? I understand that some students don't have home environments that are conductive to doing homework well. I understand that some students…

> I'd love to get good at piano without putting any homework in on it I'm pretty sure there is a way to fine-tune this [0] to auto-complete away any of your hesitations or mistakes :) [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49373456

I suppose I could always place my phone that's playing Rachmaninoff somewhere under a pile of sheet music, while I mash the keys on an unplugged electric piano.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#304

Post by est »

I find we are using AI wrong.

AI shouldn't be "helping" with homework. AI should be the homework.

Start with any topic or problem, students should be encouraged interact with AI, and learn stuff using Socratic method.

Teachers should rate the chat session instead.

And iterate the process to high profeciency.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#305

Post by salawat »

snazz wrote: post #117
theevilsharpie wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Stand-alone bottom-up observations (even if valid) obscure the fundamental problem that AI (or "AI" if you like) is inducing systemic change across human civilization. Students have been cheating and taking shortcuts on their work long before the current generation of AI tools existed (and probably for as long as graded exams have existed). Somehow, civilization has managed to survive.

When you lower the barrier to taking the shortcut, you get more people to take it who wouldn’t otherwise have done so. If cheating becomes incredibly easy, lots of students who would have otherwise been honest take the easy way out. Moral conviction gets harder to keep as doing the right thing becomes less rational.

Doing the right thing never becomes less rational. It may suck compared to the temptation towards the alternative, but part of growing up and being responsible is realizing there is a reason the shortcut isn't supposed to be normalized.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#306

Post by bendmorris »

jedberg wrote: post #189
nxc18 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> help. It could explain concepts in a way that might help you understand better People say that all the time, but does anyone really think a lack of good explanations for things is a limiting factor in 2026? Or even 2010?

When I was in college, we had office hours with the prof and the TAs, we had group study sessions, and private tutors. Or you could ask your friends. All of those required going somewhere at a specific place and time and asking someone else to give up their time for you. AI gives you a way to get the same help without asking another human. Say of that what you will, but not everyone was comfortable asking other human…

You also have your book and a wealth of online resources, which also don't require interacting with someone, and which have the same information the AI is trained on. Fundamentally nothing is different. We don't see positive outcomes from students using AI as an aid even if hypothetically it could be possible.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#307

Post by bendmorris »

moffkalast wrote: post #196
nerevarthelame wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The scary thing is that 81% of AI users in this study were determined to be "outsourcing" their homework to the LLMs - and the rate increases the more exposure they had to LLMs. The "slightly higher" performance is based on statistically insignificant samples (between 4 and 20 students, depending on the context, out of the total population of 26,000): https://bsky.app/profile/benjaminjriley.bsky.social/post/3mt...

I thought that it was generally accepted by now that homework in the volumes that it is being assigned in the modern day was not found to be beneficial in any significant way in the first place? Maybe once all students start outsourcing it to AI it might finally die like it deserves to. People these days grow up with almost no free time for themselves, it's all school, sports/extracurriculars or homework nonstop. All…

This study seems to have proven the opposite. Doing the work without AI resulted in higher exam scores.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#309

Post by robryan »

oblio wrote: post #267
jedberg wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what's going to stop the average lazy student from ignoring whatever harness the university recommends and instead use an unrestricted LLM, thus learning nothing? Nothing until they start failing exams and maybe seeing the error of their ways. My suggestions wasn't for you, it was for the smart student who wants to use AI to enhance their learning but not have it do all the work. But cheating isn't new. People have…

> But cheating isn't new. People have been cheating in school for centuries. It's easier now, but the consequences were always the same. At some point the chickens come home to roost and you pay the piper. My concern is that with LLMs and above average bullshitting abilities, the chickens might never come home to roost.

I think that is fine, certain things are becoming less important to learn and certain things more important. With the pace of change it is likely to continue shifting.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#310

Post by ipaddr »

ungreased0675 wrote: post #291
asdfman123 wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally in my own work it's pretty obvious how it's an amplifier. You waste far less time trying to find an answer to something that confuses you. You might say "it's good to learn research skills" and that's true to an extent, but tutors have always made people better students. And AI is a tutor you can message at any time, day or night, for free.

Yes, but is it the correct answer? I wasted several days trying to have AI teach me containers. I would have been much better off just reading the docs.

The knowledge AI has is vast. Communicating it to you is slow and narrow baud. The chat interface itself as a medium is lacking and will need to be replaced without another medium.
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