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AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

economist.com

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Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#271

Post by GPerson »

dgellow wrote: post #104
GPerson wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the answer. Many (all?) European schools don’t give homework (this is partly because of the way the grad programs work). It’s on the students to study in order to pass the (difficult) exams.

There is no such thing as a European school. Each country is different. And if the country is a federation, each state might be different. And we have homework in most European countries I’m aware of. What are you basing that claim on?

A European school is a school in Europe. All of my European peers in grad school reporting similar experiences.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#272

Post by GPerson »

frollogaston wrote: post #226
GPerson wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is what all my European peers reported to me during grad school, and you should care because it is an example of a system which solves this problem successfully (at the university level).

Oh, university level? The article is about 12-18yo. American grad school already doesn't have graded homework, and undergrad sometimes does or sometimes not.

I’m talking about the university level. My peers in grad school were reporting their university experiences.

And American grad school does have homework. I’m not sure why you think it does not.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#273

Post by [deleted] »

ebiederm wrote: post #256
moffkalast wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that it was generally accepted by now that homework in the volumes that it is being assigned in the modern day was not found to be beneficial in any significant way in the first place? Maybe once all students start outsourcing it to AI it might finally die like it deserves to. People these days grow up with almost no free time for themselves, it's all school, sports/extracurriculars or homework nonstop. All…

What I remember hearing is that exercises and practice are needed to transform words on the page to something you know and master. What I remember being questioned is does it make sense to do those exercises as homework or would they be better in school. Or on the flip side should school get out early like 11 or noon, like I think the german gymnasium does and have all the exercises as homework. The US system where c…

[deleted]

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#274

Post by morpheos137 »

doctorpangloss wrote: post #197
kzz102 wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not so clear that AI is an amplifier.. The paper has some fascinating analysis on this topic: "At the other end of the distribution, AI students who spend more than 65 minutes on their homework receive homework and exam scores similar to those of non-AI students, suggesting that these students do not use generative AI for homework assignments. However, this group consists entirely of students who adopted generat…

well most university exams are designed to measure how much you study. so we didn't really need a study to tell us, "Exams continue to measure what they are designed to measure." they're not designed to measure general aptitude, or function as admissions criteria, or screen for job applications, or any other numerous things they are used for. there can be many questions of pedagogy. one of them is, what do our exams…

I never studied in university and yet I acheived good exam scores. If you understand a topic and ave a reasonable memory and ability to apply my our understanding not much studying is required in my experience. If you don't understand the big picture then you got to laboriously keep track of and manipulate a bunch of disparate pieces.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#275

Post by GPerson »

kzz102 wrote: post #157
GPerson wrote: post #7

The kids who used AI and studied for a similar amount of time as the non-AI high performers apparently had similar (slightly higher) performance. The kids who used AI and did poorly used the AI to do the homework for them (this is what the article says). I believe AI is basically an amplifier of bad and good. I’m cynical about the world and assume it will be used more for bad than good, but I don’t doubt some of the…

It's not so clear that AI is an amplifier.. The paper has some fascinating analysis on this topic: "At the other end of the distribution, AI students who spend more than 65 minutes on their homework receive homework and exam scores similar to those of non-AI students, suggesting that these students do not use generative AI for homework assignments. However, this group consists entirely of students who adopted generat…

Right I was not clear enough about separating my opinion from the findings.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#276

Post by sebastiennight »

vkou wrote: post #218
moffkalast wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that it was generally accepted by now that homework in the volumes that it is being assigned in the modern day was not found to be beneficial in any significant way in the first place? Maybe once all students start outsourcing it to AI it might finally die like it deserves to. People these days grow up with almost no free time for themselves, it's all school, sports/extracurriculars or homework nonstop. All…

How do you expect students to learn anything when: 1. They don't do any homework. 2. All the in-class time is split between the teacher babysitting and playing social worker to problem students, and lecturing, with little to no opportunity to actually practice what they've learned? I understand that some students don't have home environments that are conductive to doing homework well. I understand that some students…

> I'd love to get good at piano without putting any homework in on it

I'm pretty sure there is a way to fine-tune this [0] to auto-complete away any of your hesitations or mistakes :)

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49373456

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#277

Post by pessimizer »

dgellow wrote: post #122
OroPla wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember reading about people talking how writing and reading books leads to cognitive decline because people won't need to remember things anymore. Pretty sure the way social media is designed contributes more to short attention spans and atrophy of the cerebral cortex.

The fact people were wrong in the past doesn’t mean it’s wrong with regards to AI

And they were not wrong. It's just that being able to consult with the dead, the distant, and your own past was an offsetting benefit.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#278

Post by lxe »

ezst wrote: post #169
Nevin1901 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

School has always been about creating compliant workers, not educating people. They will double down on "performing the right things" and "morals" while the economy will continue on its K shaped path as AI gets more capable.

Could it be that you vastly overgeneralize? While there's no perfect education system, many are much better than the nightmare you describe.

[dead]

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#279

Post by asdfman123 »

kzz102 wrote: post #157
GPerson wrote: post #7

The kids who used AI and studied for a similar amount of time as the non-AI high performers apparently had similar (slightly higher) performance. The kids who used AI and did poorly used the AI to do the homework for them (this is what the article says). I believe AI is basically an amplifier of bad and good. I’m cynical about the world and assume it will be used more for bad than good, but I don’t doubt some of the…

It's not so clear that AI is an amplifier.. The paper has some fascinating analysis on this topic: "At the other end of the distribution, AI students who spend more than 65 minutes on their homework receive homework and exam scores similar to those of non-AI students, suggesting that these students do not use generative AI for homework assignments. However, this group consists entirely of students who adopted generat…

Personally in my own work it's pretty obvious how it's an amplifier. You waste far less time trying to find an answer to something that confuses you.

You might say "it's good to learn research skills" and that's true to an extent, but tutors have always made people better students. And AI is a tutor you can message at any time, day or night, for free.

Re: AI boosted homework scores, then exam scores dropped: study

#280

Post by singpolyma3 »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #207
doctorpangloss wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well most university exams are designed to measure how much you study. so we didn't really need a study to tell us, "Exams continue to measure what they are designed to measure." they're not designed to measure general aptitude, or function as admissions criteria, or screen for job applications, or any other numerous things they are used for. there can be many questions of pedagogy. one of them is, what do our exams…

> well most university exams are designed to measure how much you study. Huh? They're designed to measure how much you know. They can't see how much you study, nor would they have reason to be interested.

How much you know at the moment of the exam. Not how much you truly know.
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