Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots • Hacker News Board

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#801

Post by colordrops » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:18 PM UTC

judah wrote: post #617

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we realized it was time to return to our own country The problem is that it was someone else's country. "Returning" after 2000 years and telling the people who have lived there for centuries that you rightfully own the place is insane. No one anywhere on earth would accept that.

Jews have had a continuous presence in Israel for 3,500 years. Many more returned home after the Holocaust and rebuilt cities, created new ones like Tel Aviv, turned sand into productive land.

You are either extremely ignorant or a cynical sociopath only out to serve your own interests. You spout old stereotypical hasbara that no one falls for anymore because the genocide has led everyone to be educated on the history of the region.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#802

Post by jameshilliard » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:19 PM UTC

watutalkinbout wrote: post #797

jameshilliard wrote: post #785

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Warsaw Ghetto was sealed off in November 1940 by a wall more than 10 feet high, with barbed wire and guarded gates. France was sealed off in 1938 by a line of concrete fortifications, obstacles and weapon installations called the Maginot Line. > German authorities specifically used the guards to prevent movement between the ghetto and the rest of Warsaw. French authorities specifically used the guards to prevent mo…

I'm pretty sure French guards didn't prevent movement between Germany and the rest of France.

> I'm pretty sure French guards didn't prevent movement between Germany and the rest of France.

I'm pretty sure the Israeli border guards didn't entirely prevent movement between Palestine and Israel either, at least prior to October 7th.

My point was simply that trying to claim legitimate border defenses are somehow equivalent to a concentration camp is an insane view.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#803

Post by DiogenesKynikos » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:25 PM UTC

throw5973157 wrote: post #362

dana-s wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Explain to me like I'm 5, how a nation capable of such propaganda to install bombs in communication devices, hacked to be bought by leaders of terrorist organizations, capable of bombing the leader of Iran did NOT know about this attack? And if they did know, didn't do anything to prepare for it?

When you get a bit older you will realize that just because someone does amazing things doesn’t mean they are omnipotent and omniscient. Also, there was a strong political will to try a peaceful approach to Gaza (with thousands of Gazans coming in to Israel for work every day), and with the belief that Hamas wants a peaceful approach as well. Hamas is planning further attacks now, what do you suggest Israel do about…

> Hamas is planning further attacks now, what do you suggest Israel do about it?

Remove the grievances that lead Palestinians to support armed attacks on Israel.

Israel has held millions of Palestinians under military occupation for decades. Palestinians have no rights, no future, and no hope of getting anything through negotiation. They are subjected to constant state violence and state-sanctioned pogroms.

Israel could withdraw from all of the occupied territories (East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza), which, after all, do not belong to Israel in the first place.

If it's unwilling to do that, then there's only one just and moral alternative: grant full and equal citizenship to all the Palestinians who live under Israeli rule.

Israel wants to have its cake and eat it too. It wants to keep the land, refuse the Palestinians who live there any rights, ruthlessly repress any Palestinian resistance, and then play the victim.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#804

Post by watutalkinbout » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:29 PM UTC

jameshilliard wrote: post #789

watutalkinbout wrote: post #742

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what meaning you can ascribe to this kind of statement, because whilst it is factually true in isolation, it also omits so much information it's almost meaningless. There's plenty of evidence that the Israeli government is composed of people with a similar outlook, just with a power imbalance that affords them the opportunity to be more politically sophisticated. History rhymes - I'm pretty sure that Jew…

> There's plenty of evidence that the Israeli government is composed of people with a similar outlook, just with a power imbalance that affords them the opportunity to be more politically sophisticated. Israel does have some problems with extremists getting elected but that's partially due to the proportional representation system making it easier for extremists to get elected without widespread support from the popu…

Gazans are being exterminated regardless of their actions.

The Warsaw ghettos didn't exist for very long. People are people, treat them the same way and you'll probably get similar results.

Of course, in this case both sides have magical thinking involved that gives them a divine blessing, so that changes things somewhat and makes it harder to reason with them.

Obviously the parallel I've drawn is extremely provocative. The Nazis started with a belief of dehumanism and acted on it. In the case of Israelis and Palestinians it's just the direction of travel over decades, but they look the same in many ways for a reason.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#805

Post by datsci_est_2015 » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:36 PM UTC

jameshilliard wrote: post #774

datsci_est_2015 wrote: post #744

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you attribute Palestinian support for extremism to a similar root cause? Yes. But we typically don't call oppressed peoples "extremists". For example, I wouldn't call those who rebelled in the Warsaw Ghetto "extremists". I wouldn't call a 14 year old boy who has only known struggle his whole life under apartheid an "extremist". Apartheid also has had a lasting effect on oppressor / oppressed dynamics in South Af…

> But we typically don't call oppressed peoples "extremists". Many groups are oppressed to various degrees for various reasons but restoring to terrorism(especially against civilians) is arguably an extremist response. The two are not mutually exclusive. > For example, I wouldn't call those who rebelled in the Warsaw Ghetto "extremists". They were being exterminated. I don't recall there being much terrorism targetin…

Think we're done here. I don't see a cohesive theme that deserves a response in between your responses to very specific pieces of my argument rooted in deflection and whataboutism. I feel I've expressed my viewpoint sufficiently. I don't feel like debating the definition of "terrorism", "extremist views", "race", "South Africa", etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#806

Post by slowin » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:39 PM UTC

jameshilliard wrote: post #728

datsci_est_2015 wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From my understanding Ben Gvir(who has very little overall support in Israel from the population at large) getting elected is more of a consequence of Israel having nationwide proportional representation which allows extremists to get elected. The existence of the support for those extremists has the same root cause that I stated in my original message: the artificial and strategic neocolonial state propped up by o…

> The existence of the support for those extremists has the same root cause that I stated in my original message: the artificial and strategic neocolonial state propped up by outside financial support with the expressed goal of establishing an ethnostate that eventually led to apartheid. Do you attribute Palestinian support for extremism to a similar root cause? Opinion polling indicates the extremism problem is far…

> Do you attribute Palestinian support for extremism to a similar root cause?

Defending your home and against genocide is not "extremism". Anyone who's familiar with the history of Palestine will understand why they fight for their homelands and families:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#807

Post by watutalkinbout » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:42 PM UTC

jameshilliard wrote: post #802

watutalkinbout wrote: post #797

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure French guards didn't prevent movement between Germany and the rest of France.

> I'm pretty sure French guards didn't prevent movement between Germany and the rest of France. I'm pretty sure the Israeli border guards didn't entirely prevent movement between Palestine and Israel either, at least prior to October 7th. My point was simply that trying to claim legitimate border defenses are somehow equivalent to a concentration camp is an insane view.

If you lock women and children in a ghetto, then bomb and shoot them relentlessly for months and years, people are going to want to know what book you are reading.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#808

Post by jameshilliard » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:44 PM UTC

watutalkinbout wrote: post #804

jameshilliard wrote: post #789

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's plenty of evidence that the Israeli government is composed of people with a similar outlook, just with a power imbalance that affords them the opportunity to be more politically sophisticated. Israel does have some problems with extremists getting elected but that's partially due to the proportional representation system making it easier for extremists to get elected without widespread support from the popu…

Gazans are being exterminated regardless of their actions. The Warsaw ghettos didn't exist for very long. People are people, treat them the same way and you'll probably get similar results. Of course, in this case both sides have magical thinking involved that gives them a divine blessing, so that changes things somewhat and makes it harder to reason with them. Obviously the parallel I've drawn is extremely provocati…

> Gazans are being exterminated regardless of their actions.

That's simply factually inaccurate, Hamas started the latest war while the population of Gaza was growing. The Jews started the Warsaw Ghetto uprising while they were being actively exterminated(i.e. population declining).

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#809

Post by slowin » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:45 PM UTC

yonixw wrote: post #588

jabron wrote: post #577

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is saying that? And by acknowledging that the land was bought pre-war you're also acknowledging that the (explicitly colonial) Zionist project pre-dates the Holocaust. So it has nothing to do with "nowadays", that was more than 100 years ago.

The commenter referenced 1947. And said from nowadays PERSPECTIVE about THAT time that it's a "bigoted state project". I just reminded them that the project got its population (50%+) from Jews that ran for their lives. So his NOWADAYS perspective about that time is crazy. As from the first moment, it was about protecting Jews. The only other alternative at the time was the US, but with limited immigration after WW2,…

Israel was literally created through ethnically cleansing the indigenous Palestinians:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#810

Post by dragonwriter » Tue, Aug 18, 2026, 9:46 PM UTC

jameshilliard wrote: post #798

dragonwriter wrote: post #790

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israel has openly , multiple times over decades, stated policy objectives that meet the purpose definition of genocide, and committed every single act enumerated in the Genocide Convention as constituting Genocide when committed with a genocidal goal in pursuit of those objectives as if they were using the defintion as a checklist. That there were wars going on at the time does not make it any less of a genocide.

> That there were wars going on at the time does not make it any less of a genocide. If some act is in pursuit of a legitimate war goal then that typically negates it being considered an act of genocide from my understanding of international law.

> If some act is in pursuit of a legitimate war goal then that typically negates it being considered an act of genocide from my understanding of international law.

Even if there was a dual-intent exception for acts that would be within the laws of war if done without genocidal intent (which there is not), it wouldn't apply to all the acts that are war crimes or crimes against humanity even aside from genocidal intent, such as those (including killings) done in the context or as part of collective punishment of civilian populations under occupation, use of starvation as a method of warfare, both deliberate and indiscriminate direct killing of civilians, etc.