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Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

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Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#261

Post by AndrewKemendo »

pessimizer wrote: post #234
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the best longitudinal study from the WHO There is no safe level of alcohol consumption (1). Every molecule of alcohol is measurably bad for you physically People want to conflate their personal desires and perceived social benefits with health benefits because mental health and physical health have overlaps However they need to be separate to actually make a claim about alcohol as there are millions of p…

> According to the best longitudinal study from the WHO There is no safe level of alcohol consumption This would be a misquote, but you didn't use quotes. The WHO said that they "can't identify" a safe level of alcohol consumption and that there are no studies that would indicate a safe level of alcohol consumption. > The new WHO statement clarifies: currently available evidence cannot indicate the existence of a thr…

>The WHO said that they "can't identify" a safe level of alcohol consumption and that there are no studies that would indicate a safe level of alcohol consumption.

How do you not then clonclude that there IS a safe amount such that you would then consume it.

What about this study would make anyone who is not an alcohol drinker become one?

The only answer here that is actually logical is that

you accept that there are risks to drinking alcohol, and that those risks are less important to you than whatever social personal benefit that you personally get out of it

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#263

Post by throw-the-towel »

WarmWash wrote: post #137
sjoedev wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’re building data centers in the U.S. at an unprecedented and increasing rate [1]. Is it so hard to imagine that something which was fine at one scale may begin to cause issues at some massively higher scale? If I drink one glass of wine per day, it’s probably fine. If I drink three bottles per day, I’m gonna start having problems. [1] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/monthly-spending-data-cen...

Yeah, but when we account for that scale, and look at resource usage, datacenters aren't topping the charts, or even really getting in the top 5, for anything. You have people who eat meat at every meal losing their mind over water usage and people who set their AC to 68 panicking over energy usage.

To be completely honest, normal people being able to set their AC to a sane temp does sound very valuable, and probably totally worth slowing down the slop machines a little bit.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#264

Post by benji-york »

fwip wrote: post #244
benji-york wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> even if every adult on the planet spent 250$ on AI per year this would still not cover anywhere near what's being invested. Your math does not make sense. That's something like $1.5 trillion every year. That's no where near what is being spent in AI hardware buildouts on an annual basis.

Gartner estimates that 2026 will have about $2.5 trillion in AI investments, with 2027 reaching over $3 trillion. https://www.gartner.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2026-05-1...

Those are totals, not annual spending.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#265

Post by orwin »

mediaman wrote: post #102
savanaly wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Complete tangent, but my impression is that one glass of wine per day is "fine", but you're still statistically better off in a non-trivial way by going down to zero. Not counting the benefits of course.... :)

To continue to take us off topic, there is actually pretty limited evidence that this is true. It is true that wine doesn't do anyone any good (unless you count it making people more social or something). But the effects of one glass a night is indistinguishable from zero. There are definitely statistically significant morbidity effects at 3. I've been shocked reading public health proclamations that "anything above…

Like I said on another topic: for the average man on earth, you're probably right, the carcinogenic effect of alcohol is smaller than eating red meat.

But if you are overweight or a preclinical obese, any amount of alcohol put you closer to clinical obesity.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#266

Post by [deleted] »

robotresearcher wrote: post #200
john_strinlai wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why should supply stay steady? i'm not saying it should . but it takes time to bring new power generation online. > You want to build an enormous energy sink, you should contribute to increasing the local supply! agreed

It does take time to build capacity. But if I build a new office building I’m simply not allowed to open it up and park in the neighborhood driveways today because I have a plan to build a parking structure eventually.

[deleted]

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#268

Post by sophacles »

WarmWash wrote: post #137
sjoedev wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’re building data centers in the U.S. at an unprecedented and increasing rate [1]. Is it so hard to imagine that something which was fine at one scale may begin to cause issues at some massively higher scale? If I drink one glass of wine per day, it’s probably fine. If I drink three bottles per day, I’m gonna start having problems. [1] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/monthly-spending-data-cen...

Yeah, but when we account for that scale, and look at resource usage, datacenters aren't topping the charts, or even really getting in the top 5, for anything. You have people who eat meat at every meal losing their mind over water usage and people who set their AC to 68 panicking over energy usage.

It's incredibly disingenuous to wonder why people would be concerned about projects that:

* Take a bunch of their tax money with no benefit to them

* lower their property value

* Make electricity and water more expensive (both of which make other things they use more expensive also)

* can cause other environmental impacts that raise inconvenience and expenses both directly and indirectly

so some AI douchebags can have a shiny datacenter to enable their bosses' stated desire to replace them with the very same AI might be opposed to the current AI drive datacenter boom.

Whatever actual benefits AI has, or tech in general, the way it is being approached right now is a disgusting and blatant attempt to steal as much as possible from everyone. People don't like that, and the like even less how the people doing it pretend they don't understand the dislike while building bunkers to protect themselves from the anger.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#269

Post by soundworlds »

dwoldrich wrote: post #35

I cannot figure out if this data center panic is legit or trumped up. There are legitimate nation-state and political entities that would love to create pressure for degrowth in this area. And, pollution and natural resources are a concern, yes, fine, sure. NIMBY happens, I get it ... *BUT*, we've been building huge data centers for decades and they are minuscule compared to the size of the earth. My skeptic meter ma…

There is a lot of conflicting information out there, partly because the resources / environmental consequences of the current rollouts are incredibly multi-dimensional, and most articles only focus on a subset of them - and there seems to be rapid innovation happening in some of the infrastructure that can void an article from a year ago.

The "panic" is also largely connected to a strong communal feeling (for legitimate reasons) that democratic processes are being skipped for big money and backroom deals.

I suspect - like with a lot of AI issues - if the companies building these took more time to have proper conversation with the impacted parties, there wouldn't be nearly the same backlash.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#270

Post by hofo »

WarmWash wrote: post #137
sjoedev wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’re building data centers in the U.S. at an unprecedented and increasing rate [1]. Is it so hard to imagine that something which was fine at one scale may begin to cause issues at some massively higher scale? If I drink one glass of wine per day, it’s probably fine. If I drink three bottles per day, I’m gonna start having problems. [1] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/monthly-spending-data-cen...

Yeah, but when we account for that scale, and look at resource usage, datacenters aren't topping the charts, or even really getting in the top 5, for anything. You have people who eat meat at every meal losing their mind over water usage and people who set their AC to 68 panicking over energy usage.

and if we’re gonna start worrying about how much a building raises the nearby temperatures, let’s also start looking at whether or not buildings are using dark or light colored roofing
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