this is disappointing. I need a new machine soon but I am not interested in Framework if they are going to play the usual games. Is thinkpad really it? I wasn't wildly excited about that one either.
Exciting tools are often dangerous.
Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
121–130 of 311 posts
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#122My framework was sitting in a drawer for two years and now will not turn on no matter how long I charge it. I assume there’s a dead coin cell in there somewhere or something that needs changed but it’s pretty disappointing.
This happened to my old framework. After a while of troubleshooting, I removed the battery and it will now boot reliably while plugged in. The replacement batteries aren't terribly expensive, so I'll probably buy a new one soon.
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
Arent the USB ports on the framework also soldered on? I’m looking at a picture of the motherboard right now. Unlike my MacBook it doesn’t use a daughter board for the ports. It’s straight on the main board. Seems less repairable than my MacBook.
The ports on the motherboard are soldered, but you don't use them directly. You attach "expansion cards" which slide into a slot on the laptop case which locks them in place. So those ports seldom see any forces applied to them. All your day-to-day wear (plugging/unplugging, twisting, yanking) is going to be on the port on the expansion card which you can replace for $10. It's basically like a daughter board that is…
It’s a €20 / 5 minute fix on the MacBook to swap out the USB daughterboard. The solution framework uses takes up a lot of space and doesn’t really help you if you short out the port or drop the laptop on its side.
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#124The lack of support from Framework is so damning. Nirav has been a fun CEO to watch, but this feels like a huge, huge miss. Can anyone defend this? Why would anyone purchase anything from this company ever again?
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#125I know that firmware (and software in general) has bugs. But I wonder why modern firmware for UEFI has to be so complex, that it needs updates on a regular basis. It would be nice to have a dead-simple hardware-initialisation system that doesn't need regular updates and that only has very limited attack surface.
Regular updates are not always because of bugs but to support new hardware. Or security fixes.
If the update is only for supporting new hardware, then there is usually no benefit to the user. They already have a machine that is supported by a previous firmware version. Only in those cases where a user upgrades the hardware there might be a benefit.
Why can't the BIOS/UEFI offer some basic initialisation functionality and then the OS (Linux, Windows, ...) does a more advanced initialisation? Why does it have to be so complicated?
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#126I agree with their conclusion. I somewhat regret buying my framework laptop at this stage, because the answer to every fault is "buy a new component, from framework". I'm not sure I blame them for this really, but there is no competitive market of parts (or really any market at all), which means that the reality is that you're just locking your money to them. They also often have stock issues, so woe betide you if yo…
I've had this sort of thing happen with a Dell XPS, and their response was "purchase a new laptop". While it would be great if we had stronger consumer protection, for both economic and environmental reasons I prefer the Framework approach.
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
> You've never moved your laptop without realizing it is still plugged in? No. This damage usually happens by tripping over the cord, which results in the laptop falling on the floor, so a USB-C port is the least of your worries. There's a reason Apple went back to MagSafe.
But in that situation, you know the damage _wont_ be to the USB ports on the motherboard. The motherboard is screwed to the case, and the expansion cards are locked to the case, so they won't move relative to each other. You expansion card might get damaged by the initial tripping over the cord, and some other parts might get damaged from the fall, but you can trivially buy first-party replacement parts for anything…
If you drop a framework on its side the impact on the dongles will push them onto the board. Plastic flexes. There isn’t any shock absorbing happening. I don’t see any strain relieve on those dongles.
Perhaps framework can learn from Apple here.
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
A chassis is 10% of the cost of the laptop. Reusable chassis just to put new hardware in isn’t something the average consumer is interested in. Also, buying a new mainboard every few years and putting the old mainboard on a shelf is a lot less sustainable than buying a complete new laptop and selling your old laptop to someone.
The place where the framework design really pays of is the ability to trivially swap ports. most laptops have the usbc on the motherboard so a warn out connector is a $800 repair. Even those that have separate daughterboards for IO typically will be a ~1hr+ take everything apart to fix. With a Framework, replacing a worn out connector is ~$15 and 15 seconds.
10 minutes at most on a MacBook to swap the ports. €20 for the part. How many times in the lifespan of the laptop does the average person do that?
https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/MacBook+Air+13-Inch+Late+2020+U...
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#129The lack of support from Framework is so damning. Nirav has been a fun CEO to watch, but this feels like a huge, huge miss. Can anyone defend this? Why would anyone purchase anything from this company ever again?
I've had Dell XPSs and Lenovo Thinkpads exclusively prior to Framework, and they all died by component failure. Sure, Dell will send a technician to your house and Lenovo has off-shore call centers, but the end result is the same: either buy an eye-wateringly expensive warranty that won't cover most failures or buy a new laptop.
While I'm all for stronger consumer regulation when it comes to this stuff, on balance I prefer the Framework approach here relative to the other options available to me.
Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop
#130I know that firmware (and software in general) has bugs. But I wonder why modern firmware for UEFI has to be so complex, that it needs updates on a regular basis. It would be nice to have a dead-simple hardware-initialisation system that doesn't need regular updates and that only has very limited attack surface.
SeaBIOS on a Coreboot laptop is pretty minimal. Paltry CPU speeds on anything that supports it nowadays, but fun for a beater system.
Coreboot looks promising. Do you know why the CPU speeds are so bad? And do they get better once the main operating system starts up?