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U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

genesisopenmodels.anl.gov

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Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#41

Post by jauntywundrkind »

behnamoh wrote: post #37
embedding-shape wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Laguna S 2.1 is really great too, in the "preview" release they've done so far at least. Still pending some reasoning-looping, but besides that, it's a really strong model to run within 96GB VRAM with the NVFP4 variants, and it's really good at coding (specifically).

No it doesn't follow instructions and is substantially slower than ds4.

Like glm-5.x I think it has enormous self introspection that it often trips up on, but that this self reflection is actually a superpower, that enables incredibly good output. And from (in some cases) very small models.

If you watch it think, which you can, unlike American closed models, you can steer it. You can provide a a massive rocket ship stratospheric boost to help it orient itself. You have no self correction, there is no multiplayer in American proprietary models.

Sure it's great having super powerful mystic oracles that have the "right" answers. But I love respect & revere the open thinking. No it's not automous. But it is brilliant. And it considers. A lot. Deeply. It chases. That to me is the most human of models, even as it falls far astray.

You should help it. You can. Unlike these vicious dark surfaces which yield and tell you nothing. I think this is the actual meta-core-super-point of "The session you cannot take with you" (link below). It's the session that does not care about you, will not interact with you, will not peer with you, that is a dead remote far off oracle to you. Fuck these "oracles". They are a plague against the human spirit. We should alloy humanity and AI to Augment Intellect (Engelbart). (To do less is species treason.) https://earendil.com/posts/session-portability/ https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49118781

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#42

Post by [deleted] »

MangoCoffee wrote: post #40
dmix wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly because it's generally a bad idea for government to try to compete with a brand new tech industry with hundreds of billions in private capital developing commercial models. If the American private industry does actually wash out vs Chinese open models there might be talent available for them to put money into, so maybe they are just preparing for that scenario in the meantime.

The American attitude is generally to let private companies build up a new industry so it can create jobs and pay taxes. However, in the LLM race, the Chinese open weight playbook pretty much killed that. China has basically commoditized LLMs. Chinese models are good enough, so the race has come down to who can offer the cheapest tokens.

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#43

Post by behnamoh »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #41
behnamoh wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it doesn't follow instructions and is substantially slower than ds4.

Like glm-5.x I think it has enormous self introspection that it often trips up on, but that this self reflection is actually a superpower, that enables incredibly good output. And from (in some cases) very small models. If you watch it think, which you can, unlike American closed models, you can steer it. You can provide a a massive rocket ship stratospheric boost to help it orient itself. You have no self correction…

I like the transparency of its reasoning, and I agree with you, OpenAI/Anthropic/Google should show the reasoning traces as well.

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#44

Post by villish »

robotbikes wrote: post #14
yewenjie wrote: post #3

I couldn't find any details about size or training data for the model.

It looks like they're taking applications for training data (due August 14th), so I think it's safe to say this is just an announcement of intent and a call for involvement vs. something that is readily available. Seems almost quaint in comparison to the strategy of sucking up every piece of data you can find anywhere on the Internet and feeding it to your LLM but I suspect their intent is to be more careful in what…

I have no doubt companies like Microsoft, Amazon, and Google will rush to give them all the data they want in order to keep those government contracts flowing.

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#46

Post by walrus01 »

firasd wrote: post #8

Just realized that there are basically no American open models right now ever since the Llama series was abandoned. Basically Gemma and GPT-OSS I guess? Ah but Mira Murati's new Inkling is Apache 2.0 But it makes sense that if you're a university researcher you are thinking about what's a model that will be open weight and developed over the long term and doesn't raise 'Chyna' concerns in Washington DC

Laguna is the most recent and capable one that comes to mind. In its size class it is not as "smart" in my experience as qwen 3.5 122 or DeepSeek v4 flash 0731 (all at q8), but it's also not terrible.

https://huggingface.co/unsloth/Laguna-S-2.1-GGUF

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#47

Post by walrus01 »

embedding-shape wrote: post #25
ipsum2 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a bunch of American open models. Inkling, Nemotron, Trinity come to mind, but I'm sure there's others.

Laguna S 2.1 is really great too, in the "preview" release they've done so far at least. Still pending some reasoning-looping, but besides that, it's a really strong model to run within 96GB VRAM with the NVFP4 variants, and it's really good at coding (specifically).

There was an obvious problem in the original release, they re issued it after like a week with the reasoning looping supposedly fixed.

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#48

Post by kadoban »

behnamoh wrote: post #37
embedding-shape wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Laguna S 2.1 is really great too, in the "preview" release they've done so far at least. Still pending some reasoning-looping, but besides that, it's a really strong model to run within 96GB VRAM with the NVFP4 variants, and it's really good at coding (specifically).

No it doesn't follow instructions and is substantially slower than ds4.

It's a lot smaller, and runs (quantized) on a 3090 quite well. Ds4 flash 0731 you're talking about? It's great but it's much harder to run locally.

Re: U.S. Department of Energy Launches the Genesis Open Models Initiative

#50

Post by logicallee »

firasd wrote: post #8

Just realized that there are basically no American open models right now ever since the Llama series was abandoned. Basically Gemma and GPT-OSS I guess? Ah but Mira Murati's new Inkling is Apache 2.0 But it makes sense that if you're a university researcher you are thinking about what's a model that will be open weight and developed over the long term and doesn't raise 'Chyna' concerns in Washington DC

I've used Inkling a lot recently, it's an American open model and is really good!
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