I've tried Herdr a couple of times, and just can't get into it. I think what's off putting is another layer of keyboard shortcuts over my terminal...I don't see what it's doing that Wezterm and a bunch of splits does anyway? I'm almost certainly missing the point.
Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
161–170 of 197 posts
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#162Earlier quoted context omitted.
The copyleft licenses are toxic for adoption. Companies default away from them because there are a lot of murky unknowns (e.g. if you run a copyleft service and connect to it via API, is that extending it? Does that service’s source have to be shared?) that simply aren’t worth the hassle. If you want your library to get traction with many real world use cases, you need to have a permissive license. If you want to sti…
I'm not sure why you're being downvoted, you're right. Using software that has requires people to contribute back is a huge liability, and hurts adoption, which is the most important metric for herdr right now.
> Using software that has requires people to contribute back is a huge liability, and hurts adoption,
In other words, not being a parasite is stressful.
Cruel world where I'm not allowed to just take, take, take
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#163So I won’t have switch to Fchte or Schlirmchr?
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
> if you run a copyleft service and connect to it via API, is that extending it No, it isn't; a client talking to an AGPLv3 service over a network API stays a separate program and is not touched by the license at all. Section 13 places obligations solely on whoever runs a modified version of the service, while remote users, API clients included, only gain the right to receive that service's source. So nothing on the…
You may think this. I may think this. But what really matters is if the lawyers for your customers think this. It may be pure FUD, but AGPL projects have a tough time getting adoption in companies because they would rather avoid the problem than be wrong.
We have been running a business on exactly the opposite premise for over 20 years, and we're not really seeing that problem with the adoption of Proxmox VE or our other (AGPLv3) FLOSS projects that we provide commercial enterprise support for. Very rarely, a potential customer doing extra due diligence, and not yet used to working with FLOSS much, wonders about exactly this - which is also the main reason I bothered writing anything here, as spreading such FUD further only hurts everyone involved. In those cases, a simple reply that a) this makes no sense (more on that below) and b) an assurance in writing that none of their software running on top of, or interfacing with, any of our APIs has to be relicensed settles it. That assurance is technically useless, as it doesn't grant them anything extra, but it costs us nothing either.
And the reason it makes no sense is that by your logic, any tool that can consume some (e.g. HTTP-based REST) API would have to be open-sourced the moment I get it to fetch data from my AGPLv3 service. No offense meant at all, but that would simply be bizarro world, and there is enough precedent against it. If APIs did not act as clear boundaries, AGPLv3 software would indeed spread to everything it touches or traverses, like an epidemic. If yours or your customers' lawyers claim otherwise, you/they should get ones with an actual understanding of software and IP law.
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
https://herdr.dev/compare/
It answers the "What" but not the "Why?"
Not sure I understand your question. You literally asked, "WHAT is it that makes herdr et al so popular"?
Why? Because it has more/better features. Or you mean something else?
Specifically against cmux, it is not Macosonly. So you can run it directly on a linux server and then ssh/mosh from anywhere.
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#166that sucks, time to look for a new one
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#167I switched from tmux to Herdr about six weeks ago. It's a great bit of software, the UI is focused on switching between multiple agents quickly. I run Herdr to keep my opencode instances well managed, and it also works great for having a few terminals opens next to your agent. I find myself keeping opencode sessions open for longer like what happens with Codex and Claude code, which is great if I need to revisit a co…
Honestly, how are you guys running multiple agents, presumably with them all writing code? I find myself to be a huge bottleneck, having to do technical design and design reviews, to make sure they're actually working on the right things. I feel like there's not enough coding work to justify multiple agents, that part doesn't take long, and then it's back to design again.
> I find myself to be a huge bottleneck, having to do technical design and design reviews, to make sure they're actually working on the right things.
I find this depends on the LLMs being used and the person using them and the problems being solved.
Like, Fable can be sent off to do some big thing for a long while and I find myself getting bored and move over to push on some other thing. Or, while reading a paper I have a string of follow up questions and ideas and launch them via web or CLI agent. Or I bounce between multiple chores in different packages, each of which is fast for an LLM and a low cognitive burden for me. Then other times, something needs my full, ongoing and serial attention where the LLM turn is only a minor element. I'll use the brief LLM interludes to get up, walk around a bit, stretch and think.
As for Herdr, it seems nice when I tried it a few weeks ago. But, I'm surprised it is getting so much attention (kudos). Like many people, I've developed more than one work-alike before Herdr hit the scene. They were based on tmux which I have concluded I simply detest. In the end, I made a little agent hook script that speaks to Kitty terminal and that plus Kitty and a stable SSH persistent connection gives 80% of what I was looking for. I do still like the "control panel" aspect of my past and herdr's tries. Adding that would get me another 10%.
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
It answers the "What" but not the "Why?"
Not sure I understand your question. You literally asked, "WHAT is it that makes herdr et al so popular"? Why? Because it has more/better features. Or you mean something else? Specifically against cmux, it is not Macosonly. So you can run it directly on a linux server and then ssh/mosh from anywhere.
> Why? Because it has more/better features. Or you mean something else?
I mean something else. Zoom out, why do people need, or want, a tool like herdr?
What has led people to this point? Is it because they need terminal multiplexing to spawn agents, instead of using built-in subagents? Do they like cute sheep icons? What made having multiple terminals open unappealing? Is it the built-in alerting when attention is needed? Is it only applicable to people running their agents on remote machines?
When I look at these kinds of tools, that is the question I can't answer because I suspect I haven't run into the pain points they address yet, despite running multiple LLM sessions in multiple projects simultaneously.
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
What made you prefer it to tmux? Looking at their demo, they put a lot of emphasis on the workspace like feature which tmux already got with sessions. Not sure what is the point of all those new tui runtime, tried a few but always got back to tmux, what am I missing?
What you’re missing is the status updates. Herdr applies pattern recognition to detect the status of an agent running inside, so you get updates on all your agent threads at a glance.
Status updates aren’t a big deal when running cheap&fast models, but are a big deal once you start making asks that take 5min+.
Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure I understand your question. You literally asked, "WHAT is it that makes herdr et al so popular"? Why? Because it has more/better features. Or you mean something else? Specifically against cmux, it is not Macosonly. So you can run it directly on a linux server and then ssh/mosh from anywhere.
> Why? Because it has more/better features. Or you mean something else? I mean something else. Zoom out, why do people need, or want, a tool like herdr? What has led people to this point? Is it because they need terminal multiplexing to spawn agents, instead of using built-in subagents? Do they like cute sheep icons? What made having multiple terminals open unappealing? Is it the built-in alerting when attention is n…
Strictly from personal opinion
1) Built-in sub agents assume you use a single AI agent. Some people use multiple, so they need separate terminals/processes by definition. Even if you use the same agent sometimes you have different security boundaries. Think also the needs for a consultant working with many customers at once.
2)Multiple-open terminals. When that number passes 5-7 for me, then yes I don't like clicking on each one of those manually to see where my attention is needed. Herdr (and similar tools) show exactly what is working and what stalled.
3) No I use herdr locally mostly right now. But since it is just ssh I like the fact that you can run it from anywhere. I haven't done it yet, but I imagine you could open a herdr session from a steamdeck to a remote server to debug somthing
Another thing I like on herdr is easy work trees. Sure you can do it manually with git commands, or ask the agent itself to use a new worktree, but just having workrees with a single click and a visual tree/children hierarchy was the killer feature for making me look at herdr at the first place.
Yes technically you can do the same thing with just many terminals and custom scripts. But it is the same question of why Dropbox sells when you could do the same thing with cvs/ftp :-)