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Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

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Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#151

Post by lawrencechen »

Oras wrote: post #133
porker wrote: post #129

herdr users (and all the other terminal multiplexer users): what am I missing? I use cmux because I like tabbed terminals on macOS grouped by project, saves messing with our daft window management. What is it that makes herdr et al so popular with LLM users?

I loved using cmux for several weeks until I saw the ram usage.

Totally fair, maker of cmux here. We fixed many RAM usage issues (latest version is 0.64.22), and also added an activity monitor to see how much RAM/CPU coding agents are taking.

My cmux has been running with 136 workspaces and 218 terminals, and has been hovering around 5.7 GB. Granted, the theoretical RAM minimum for this number of terminals is around 1-1.5 GB before real scrollback, so we definitely have more work to do.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#152

Post by lawrencechen »

pecheny wrote: post #150
sarky-litso wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't tell if this is sarcasm but in case its not, being capable of doing something and having the desire and resources to do it are not the same thing

Not sarcasm at all. I think you might overestimate the time and effort needed for this. When you maintain a _personal_ fork with no users except yourself, you only ever need to change something when you encounter a bug or need a new feature. E.g. I have personal forks of mosh and cmux, each took maybe 1 hour of my time total? I found this article https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49156111 resonating with me, excep…

Very curious about your cmux fork, any chance you could link the repo? (Maker of cmux here :))

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#153

Post by inigyou »

mbreese wrote: post #92
tlamponi wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if you run a copyleft service and connect to it via API, is that extending it No, it isn't; a client talking to an AGPLv3 service over a network API stays a separate program and is not touched by the license at all. Section 13 places obligations solely on whoever runs a modified version of the service, while remote users, API clients included, only gain the right to receive that service's source. So nothing on the…

You may think this. I may think this. But what really matters is if the lawyers for your customers think this. It may be pure FUD, but AGPL projects have a tough time getting adoption in companies because they would rather avoid the problem than be wrong.

If they're customers, just sell them the license they want.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#154

Post by Oras »

lawrencechen wrote: post #151
Oras wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I loved using cmux for several weeks until I saw the ram usage.

Totally fair, maker of cmux here. We fixed many RAM usage issues (latest version is 0.64.22), and also added an activity monitor to see how much RAM/CPU coding agents are taking. My cmux has been running with 136 workspaces and 218 terminals, and has been hovering around 5.7 GB. Granted, the theoretical RAM minimum for this number of terminals is around 1-1.5 GB before real scrollback, so we definitely have more work…

Thanks, good to know. I installed the update and will check it out again.

If it helps, the main reason I love cmux is how can I manage my projects into folders, I have fast access to all the projects which made my life a lot easier working in the terminal. I can also have coding, test, monitoring spilt in one tab per project.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#155

Post by porker »

kkapelon wrote: post #139
porker wrote: post #129

herdr users (and all the other terminal multiplexer users): what am I missing? I use cmux because I like tabbed terminals on macOS grouped by project, saves messing with our daft window management. What is it that makes herdr et al so popular with LLM users?

https://herdr.dev/compare/

It answers the "What" but not the "Why?"

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#156

Post by pecheny »

lawrencechen wrote: post #152
pecheny wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sarcasm at all. I think you might overestimate the time and effort needed for this. When you maintain a _personal_ fork with no users except yourself, you only ever need to change something when you encounter a bug or need a new feature. E.g. I have personal forks of mosh and cmux, each took maybe 1 hour of my time total? I found this article https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49156111 resonating with me, excep…

Very curious about your cmux fork, any chance you could link the repo? (Maker of cmux here :))

Oh wow :) thank you for cmux, it's a great project!

The code is here: https://code.pecheny.me/pecheny/cmux or if you prefer github, https://github.com/alexander-pecheny/cmux

I think I only added two features, pasting images over mosh (ssh already worked but not mosh) and a compact version of sidebar.

The story behind the fork is: I had a bug with raycast, filed a PR that fixed it for me https://github.com/manaflow-ai/cmux/pull/2435, a different fix made it into next release that for me didn't work. Maybe the problem was on my side, but at this point it was easier to fork the working version than debug further.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#157

Post by la_fayette »

I started using Herdr and I really like it. Since the main features I wanted are already there, I have no issue with the commercialization. I still wonder how this can be turned into a profitable business. It'll be really interesting to follow Herdr's future. All the best to the founder!

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#158

Post by athrowaway3z »

ahmadyan wrote: post #52

Congrats to Can on the pre-seed funding. genuinely wishing you all the best. The terminal multiplexer / multi-agent coding space is getting very crowded. YC alone has funded many competing startups in this space: herdr, Superset, cmux, Emdash, Orca, Bullet, Conductor (Conductor was in YC before pivoting from chat->coding). I’m probably missing a few, and that’s before counting companies outside YC such as Superlogica…

> Is OSS important because you want to inspect the code, fork it, self-host it, avoid vendor lock-in, or simply because you trust open-source developer tools more? Or, for desktop software like IDEs is open source mostly a nice-to-have rather than a requirement? So I’m curious where HN lands on this

I frankly do not understand the question, and it reads like one you'd find in a survey written by somebody who does not understand the question themselves.

I do not need to preach to the choir, so I will use an awkward analogy for the people treating this like a survey:

OSS is like cash, and closed source is investing in PE (and in this case historically very underwhelming returns).

Cash gives opportunity in every dimension you mention, including the option to jump into a PE. There is no need to worry or monitor its value beyond depreciation.

OSS provides me every opportunity I want, at no recurring overhead costs, and only drawing on my attention when I want it.

Beyond that: buying into an ecosystem has a network-effect value, and the ability for any 1 person to add value to the ecosystem is dependent by how easy it is to add value to it - and here OSS has some natural pros.

But i do not think these things matter. These are considerations for people looking to build near the edge of whats possible, and those are a niche. If you're looking for what you can sell, for any problem there are several orders of magnitude more people that dont know whats already possible and just want things made 'easy'.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#159

Post by Aeolun »

ahmadyan wrote: post #52

Congrats to Can on the pre-seed funding. genuinely wishing you all the best. The terminal multiplexer / multi-agent coding space is getting very crowded. YC alone has funded many competing startups in this space: herdr, Superset, cmux, Emdash, Orca, Bullet, Conductor (Conductor was in YC before pivoting from chat->coding). I’m probably missing a few, and that’s before counting companies outside YC such as Superlogica…

It doesn’t matter to me because all the stuff I use now is open source built by me. Whether or not it goes closed source is entirely up to me.

I am however quite annoyed by these “open source until it gets popular enough” schemes. But then again, it’s never happened to me.

Re: Herdr is joining Y Combinator. The runtime stays open

#160

Post by vidarh »

skinfaxi wrote: post #85
giodamelio wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's super important to me. I use Herdr every day and I maintain a whole stack of changes. From minor comfort tweaks that are just preference, to several larger changes like add jj workspace support and a WIP web based view (powered by xterm.js). This is not the only project like this too. Many of my devtools are piling up changes. I try to upstream changes where it makes sense, but many times they are either very be…

> LLMs have made making personal changes to devtools so effortless that I am now extremely hesitant to use any non source available software at all This mirrors my view so totally it's crazy. If AI is ushering in the era of personal tooling, closing the harness is orthogonal to what users want.

I also don't think closed source is going to work for any software where you can't aggressively prevent the user from introspecting a large chunk of the software, because it's so easy to point an agent at the tool and tell it to copy the functionality you actually care about and/or wrap it.
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