How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise • Hacker News Board

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#101

Post by ozlikethewizard » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 4:30 PM UTC

pickleglitch wrote: post #79

ozlikethewizard wrote: post #65

Regardless of your actual views on the systems, as a non-american it's absolutely insane that so many people are incapable of thinking of one positive of a socialist economic system. I wouldn't describe myself as either a socialist or a capatalist, but with just a cursory ponder I can think of several benefits to both. The complete inability for critical thinking is quite saddening, and quite worrying considering ame…

I'm convinced most Americans have no idea what socialism means, or even what capitalism means.

The other reply certainly supports this view

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#102

Post by ozlikethewizard » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 4:35 PM UTC

ifwinterco wrote: post #89

ozlikethewizard wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is the natural end state of capitalism though? Capital begets more capital, eventually concentrating power as far as possible. Sure you get upstarts here and there, particularly with technological innovation, but the trend is always consistent.

Arguably the natural end state of every system to be honest. Power, money and influence were concentrated in the Soviet Union, they're concentrated in modern day China...

Wouldn't argue. I guess the difference is philosophical. Capitalism is designed to reach that end goal, the very nature of capital growth requires consolidation. Philosophically, both the USSRs & China's implementations of socialism were "intended" to be pathways to communism, where power is controlled communally. The fact that no country has managed to transition out of the socialist state into communism is a pretty damning indictment of it though, power corrupts in all it's forms.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#103

Post by ifwinterco » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 4:51 PM UTC

lapcat wrote: post #68

ifwinterco wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is not really capitalist, it’s an oligarchy - a small number of people like Larry Ellison essentially control everything. It’s always been like that, even going back to the 19th century and the robber barons of the gilded age

This was by design of the oligarchic founders, who were very skeptical of the majority, so it goes back to the 18th century too.

To be fair the US has been an extremely successful country all things considered, so maybe they were onto something

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#104

Post by tw04 » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 5:01 PM UTC

mytailorisrich wrote: post #87

tw04 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

State ownership of companies is LITERALLY the definition of socialism. > a theory or system of social organization that advocates the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, capital, land, etc., by the community as a whole, usually through a centralized government.

State ownership of all companies, yes, that's one implementation of socialism though not "literally the definition". But obviously this isn't how China is now and even state-owned companies in China generally operate in a market and can be in competition with private companies and other state-owned companies. In fact the Chinese eoconomy is probably more competitive that in the West now, it is fierce competition for…

No, not all. I can only assume you've never even taken an entry level poli sci course, because socialism has never required COMPLETE ownership by the state. Furthermore, as I linked previously, in China it is north of 70% ownership by the state.

>But obviously this isn't how China is now and even state-owned companies in China generally operate in a market and can be in competition with private companies and other state-owned companies.

"Compete's in a market" is irrelevant to socialism. Again, basic poli sci, socialism encompasses both free market and captured market. What makes it socialism is government ownership of the means of production, with redistribution to the general populace.

>There are state-owned companies in all Western countries, by the way.

Right, and which western "capitalist" society has state ownerhsip of 70%+ of the "private" companies that make up its economy? Correct, 0. Socialism has never required the state to own all business in a given economy anymore than capitalism has required 0 ownership.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#105

Post by therealdrag0 » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 5:07 PM UTC

rebolek wrote: post #59

RickJWagner wrote: post #9

I’d like to understand how they defined capitalism vs free enterprise for the poll participants. I’m encouraged by parts of the poll, especially independents responses. I think a good many Americans perceive benefits to some degree of socialism ( ie healthcare ), but without going overboard.

As I understand it, free enterprise is regulated environment to prevent monopolies, capitalism is unregulated which results in monopolies and kills free enterprise.

Capitalism is an economic system; free enterprise is just a principle or philosophy, which is often used in capitalism. Capitalism is about who owns productive assets (vs socialism); free enterprise is about who directs production and prices (vs command economy)

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#106

Post by lapcat » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 5:16 PM UTC

ifwinterco wrote: post #103

lapcat wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was by design of the oligarchic founders, who were very skeptical of the majority, so it goes back to the 18th century too.

To be fair the US has been an extremely successful country all things considered, so maybe they were onto something

At its founding, the United States and the founders themselves exploited slave labor, so I wouldn't be so quick to praise what they were onto. There's also the matter of ethnic cleansing the Native Americans.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#107

Post by rawgabbit » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 6:10 PM UTC

ozlikethewizard wrote: post #65

Regardless of your actual views on the systems, as a non-american it's absolutely insane that so many people are incapable of thinking of one positive of a socialist economic system. I wouldn't describe myself as either a socialist or a capatalist, but with just a cursory ponder I can think of several benefits to both. The complete inability for critical thinking is quite saddening, and quite worrying considering ame…

Words in American politics have lost their original meaning. Words in American politics mean whatever the national committee say they mean for that week.

Communism means everyone who opposes Trump.

Freedom means parroting whatever nonsense Trump says today.

Socialism means everyone who rejects the current corporate oligarchs.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#108

Post by scoofy » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 6:34 PM UTC

I live in SF and the biggest issue I see regularly with this debate is that most Americans seem to be conflating "capitalism" with various things that aren't directly related.

First, I see Americans regularly conflating "socialism" to "wealth redistribution" and "capitalism" to "no taxes."

Second, I see many folks conflating high-trust cooperation to "socialism" and low-trust hostility to "capitalism."

Ultimately, capitalism and socialism is about who owns the means of production. While most economies are mixed, the countries we point to as socialism aren't actually socialist. They're just redistributive, high-trust capitalism. Sweden, Denmark, and Germany are predominantly capitalist countries. Bolivia and Venezuela are predominantly socialist countries.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#109

Post by scoofy » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 6:36 PM UTC

pickleglitch wrote: post #79

ozlikethewizard wrote: post #65

Regardless of your actual views on the systems, as a non-american it's absolutely insane that so many people are incapable of thinking of one positive of a socialist economic system. I wouldn't describe myself as either a socialist or a capatalist, but with just a cursory ponder I can think of several benefits to both. The complete inability for critical thinking is quite saddening, and quite worrying considering ame…

I'm convinced most Americans have no idea what socialism means, or even what capitalism means.

I'm convinced the vast majority of people use the terms "capitalism" and "socialism" to mean whatever is convenient in the argument they are having.

Capitalism and socialism are about ownership of the means of production.

While most economies are mixed. Nations typically associated with "socialism" like Sweden and Denmark are mostly capitalist. Nations like Bolivia and Venezuela are the ones that are actually mostly socialist.

It's entirely possible to have a highly redistributive capitalist country, with a strong social safety net. It's also entirely possible to have a socialist country with extreme wealth inequality and a terrible social safety net. It just depends on how things are structured.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#110

Post by nec4b » Thu, Aug 06, 2026, 10:19 PM UTC

exceptione wrote: post #70

mytailorisrich wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People really need to give up the cold war, the failures of "end of history" thinking are directly related to all of the economic problems we have today. That's irrelevant to the point. The 1980s did settle the capitalism vs. socialism debate. The USSR and, perhaps more consequentially, China effectively abandonned socialism because it failed and acknowledged that capitalism, free enterprise, and the free market wa…

> capitalism vs. socialism One thing I learned from observing the Americans is how tainted the concept of socialism has become in their discourse. I have a hunch there has been some cultural engineering behind this, but reasons aside, the confusion is unfortunate. I learned that when an American talks about socialism, they usually mean communism and often the accompanying dictatorships that enable this oppressive sys…

>Meanwhile, the social-democratic countries...

Which don't have anything in common with socialist countries.

https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/denmark-tells-...