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Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

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Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#131

Post by crazygringo »

tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #95
VCFundedGenYer wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you both-sidesing this? Apple is doing it right, simple high level statements. OpenAI is acting like a teenager posting screenshots of literal texts and being overall petulant. This is open and shut. The mature company will win this.

Looking at things from multiple perspectives and trying to see validity in each point of view is a virtue, not a vice. I really hate that "both-sides" has become a copy-paste insult by ideologues.

It's a virtue when there is validity to both sides.

But it's extremely harmful when there isn't.

"Alice says murder is bad, while Bob says murder is a fun and healthy recreational activity. Trying to see validity in each point of view is a virtue, not a vice." See, it doesn't work.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#132

Post by Melatonic »

paxys wrote: post #93
jdross wrote: post #69

Apple is cutthroat in business too. Tony Fadell, the inventor of the iPod and co-inventor of the iPhone, and later Nest founder, commented this in Stratechery about the lawsuit when filed: "This is Apple’s typical tactic to scare Apple employees — either former or current. I heard this lawsuit was driven by the Apple board. Steve threatened to file a lawsuit against Nest for poaching 80-100 Apple employees. He called…

Apple was the ringleader in the illegal anti-poaching agreements between SV companies a couple decades ago.

And successfully at the time (illegally) squashed unionization efforts by software engineers

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#133

Post by [deleted] »

paxys wrote: post #123

This entire OpenAI hardware thing is a vanity project by Sam Altman wanting really bad to be Steve Jobs. Just look at this comical announcment photo and letter from last year https://openai.com/sam-and-jony/ . If this lawsuit results in the whole thing getting canned it might actually be good for OpenAI because it'll save them from pouring further billions down the drain over what will eventually be the Humane Pin 2.…

[deleted]

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#134

Post by bilekas »

jdross wrote: post #69

Apple is cutthroat in business too. Tony Fadell, the inventor of the iPod and co-inventor of the iPhone, and later Nest founder, commented this in Stratechery about the lawsuit when filed: "This is Apple’s typical tactic to scare Apple employees — either former or current. I heard this lawsuit was driven by the Apple board. Steve threatened to file a lawsuit against Nest for poaching 80-100 Apple employees. He called…

Jobs had something to prove though. He was kicked out, brought back, he definitely wanted to ensure his legacy. But while I don't agree with it, I think it's harder to be an ethical company that makes it to a billion than a non ethical one. When shareholders are involved you don't have a choice really.. You're obliged to maximize their earnings.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#135

Post by crazygringo »

paxys wrote: post #118

When I was interviewing for a new software job a couple years ago every company wanted to know details about past projects. What I built, what technical decisions I took, what scale I operated at, what the setbacks were, what was the final result. Some companies even made the round presentation style, like a real tech spec review, and you had to present slides and architecture diagrams. And the project had to be real…

> But in practice every tech interviewee and every company doing interviews today (including Apple) can be charged with most of what Apple is alleging.

No it can't. I've worked for a bunch of tech companies large and small and interviewed for way more, and I have literally never seen this.

What Apple is alleging is not normal at all, nor is your interview experience. I've literally never even heard of anything like you describe, presenting architecture diagrams of your previous work? That's such a huge red flag, and these companies are opening themselves up to similar lawsuits. The fact that you describe multiple companies requesting this is genuinely shocking to me.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#136

Post by Melatonic »

bigyabai wrote: post #9
SiempreViernes wrote: post #5

> And, [OpenAI] said that Apple didn’t admit to the claim that the “residual access” allowing former employees to access Apple’s system was the result of poor security procedures on Apple’s part. Sam "I hack others by mistake" Altman dunking on the security practice of others is funny, is there any glass house he won't go to?

In fairness, that's an incredibly glaring MDM problem that was always going to blow up like a landmine if Apple didn't address it. I'd expect the macOS MDM policy to cover this if Apple was actually concerned about IP leakage.

Yup - exactly. Its crazy they havent developed a solution to this for their customers (let alone themselves) or bought out one of the companies that tries

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#137

Post by bilekas »

Melatonic wrote: post #132
paxys wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple was the ringleader in the illegal anti-poaching agreements between SV companies a couple decades ago.

And successfully at the time (illegally) squashed unionization efforts by software engineers

I think that's just standard across the US. But the unions are a people problem not a company problem necessarily. People can still form unions even with massive investments to squash them.. Europe has proven that. But the story told to all US workers SEEMS to be, you have to suffer and grind to make money.

I might be wrong but that's the impression I get when talking with US people about unions and workers rights.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#138

Post by KerrAvon »

paxys wrote: post #118

When I was interviewing for a new software job a couple years ago every company wanted to know details about past projects. What I built, what technical decisions I took, what scale I operated at, what the setbacks were, what was the final result. Some companies even made the round presentation style, like a real tech spec review, and you had to present slides and architecture diagrams. And the project had to be real…

You're making assumptions that aren't supported if you read the actual lawsuit.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#139

Post by paul7986 »

tw600040 wrote: post #130
paul7986 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe Apple will buy Open AI at a rock bottom price after this lawsuit. I've used chatGPT voice conversation tech since Sept 2023 and was expecting the new Siri to match the user experience. The new Siri is far far away from matching chatGPT's voice tech. The new Siri is smarter and can now answer your question for anything yet it's SLOWer and you can not have a full conversation with it. I continually have to say "H…

Because chatGPT can get away with listening to you all the time, but if Siri does that without it being explicitly prompted it will be a class action

Well Apple is building a slew of AI voice devices, Open AI is too and purportedly so is Space X creating an AI focused phone.

We'll see if consumers embrace it, but ive been using chatGPT's voice conversation tech since Sept 2023 especially while driving to get things done. For me it feels like the next natural UX Internet usage paradigm.

Re: Apple says more ex-employees may have taken confidential data to OpenAI

#140

Post by hbn »

walrus01 wrote: post #127
paxys wrote: post #123

This entire OpenAI hardware thing is a vanity project by Sam Altman wanting really bad to be Steve Jobs. Just look at this comical announcment photo and letter from last year https://openai.com/sam-and-jony/ . If this lawsuit results in the whole thing getting canned it might actually be good for OpenAI because it'll save them from pouring further billions down the drain over what will eventually be the Humane Pin 2.…

[flagged]

We are all long aware that Jobs was a flawed individual.

But he made good products that most people like to use. That was GP they were getting at with "he wants to be Steve Jobs."

You don't need to hamfist that into the conversation every times Jobs' name comes up.

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