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Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

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Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#231

Post by badsectoracula »

throwaw12 wrote: post #227
toshinoriyagi wrote: post #8

They've also announced Qwen3.8-27B being released open-weight next week. Qwen3.6-27B is widely regarded as one of the best local models, especially since nothing else comes close to it, that isn't benchmaxxed, without being significantly larger. If 3.8 truly improves upon it that would be awesome.

Qwen3.8-Max is the first in Qwen-Max series to be open-weight as well. Kimi K3, GLM 5.2 and now Qwen3.8-Max - open weight models. DeepSeek V4 Flash outperforming Gemini 3.1 pro, probably DeepSeek V4 Pro update is also coming soon Chinese labs are cooking very hard. US closed weight labs are probably hard time to resist not calling Washington DC for more AI regulations

Kimi K3 is more like "weights available" in that you can download and use them but it is under a custom license that has a bunch of limitations where you have to pay Moonshot for doing some stuff. GLM 5.2 on the other hand is plain old MIT.

Not sure how Qwen3.8-Max is going to be licensed, hopefully it'll be Apache like the smaller ones.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#232

Post by rzerowan »

Fordec wrote: post #119
storus wrote: post #67

I think the window for a ban of open weight models is closing fast so let's hope US administration is going to miss it and we get Fable-level models (at least in some aspects) with open weights without infringing any newly introduced law as a long-term local baseline.

Even if the US does ban it, Europe due to its lack of European competitors, has no current similar protectionist incentives. Even if there is regulatory capture in the US, the rest of the world isn't going to follow suit until the current market leaders outright are replaced with other competitors that Europe would want to favor. The genie is out of the bottle in the West already.

Theres a pretty big chance imho that europe will follow suit , or at least the segmenets that are fully aligned with the US on all things china even to their own detriment. Remeber rip and replace Huawei 5G because of national security , leading to some parts of europe having worse coverage than some tiny african markets. Best bet would be for europe to look at it like what it is an open source commodity that is useful to build on rather than a moat to extract rents with.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#234

Post by yassa9 »

toshinoriyagi wrote: post #8

They've also announced Qwen3.8-27B being released open-weight next week. Qwen3.6-27B is widely regarded as one of the best local models, especially since nothing else comes close to it, that isn't benchmaxxed, without being significantly larger. If 3.8 truly improves upon it that would be awesome.

as much as im excited for it, sadly it gonna be one of the reasons to push ram prices higher

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#235

Post by bonesss »

applicative wrote: post #108
kopirgan wrote: post #53

Can a model be stripped off anything not relevant to coding and get a lot lighter? Or is that impossible? Just like we have professors with specialisation wondering if AI models can also be so.

Does this desideratum make any sense? The whole point is that you write to it in English or Urdu, and it writes the specified code. If you cut off everything but the code writing, you cut off everything.

Domain modelling as well: we have clear programming concepts, but the kind of autocomplete that can autocomplete a customer sales process needs to be able to refer/leverage ontological connections on words like ‘bass’, ‘season’, ‘rebate’, and ‘jamboree’.

Intuitively it feels like focused models should be better models, but human programmers are ‘better’ knowing programming alongside general stuff. We’re not reduced by reading economics or Tolkien, removing such knowledge would be premature optimization.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#236

Post by seanmcdirmid »

perbu wrote: post #147
docheinestages wrote: post #124

It was a matter of time for China to catch up with the US. In terms of infrastructure, manufacturing, and engineering workforce, China has the upperhand and I foresee them becoming the SOTA leaders. Maybe if the US wasn't so busy gatekeeping and keeping things proprietary, they would've had more trust from the open source community.

First and foremost, China isn't energy-limited like the US is. A modern grid, lost of cheap power coming online every day. The worlds most advance ultra-high voltage transport links are tying the deserts in the west to the cities in the south. It probably sucks for you if the proposed powerline goes through your house, but the need of the many come first. Having cheap and plentiful power is a huge market advantage. I…

I think this is really a rosy image of China’s electrify situation. They have huge needs in the east and green energy in the west, they can’t build their UHV links fast enough. They are doing ok at keeping up, but there isn’t a surplus of cheap electricity lying around in the same places where you have cheap water as well.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#237

Post by Mashimo »

hobofan wrote: post #182
perbu wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First and foremost, China isn't energy-limited like the US is. A modern grid, lost of cheap power coming online every day. The worlds most advance ultra-high voltage transport links are tying the deserts in the west to the cities in the south. It probably sucks for you if the proposed powerline goes through your house, but the need of the many come first. Having cheap and plentiful power is a huge market advantage. I…

The US also isn't energy-limited. They'll just price out all humans living there from buying any electricity. EDIT: This was obviously meant to be facetious with the intent to highlight the negative effects on the general population that datacenter buildout has in the US.

> The US also isn't energy-limited.

I have not looked into it, but I have heard a lot of new data center have to run on site gas turbine on trailers to have enough power.

If the US is not energy limited, why they do that?

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#238

Post by mnicky »

akmarinov wrote: post #155
coredev_ wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean there is Mistral?

I mean it’s not competitive at all?

It’s more that they have a different business case than competing for the top spots on public benchmarks.

They seem to be oriented more toward customizing models for the concrete needs of a company, on-prem deployment, proprietary knowledge-bases, etc.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#239

Post by vorticalbox »

anon-3988 wrote: post #228

What is the best LLM that I can use right now that is optimized for everything other than coding? The last thing I want my personal agent to do is to write up code and run arbitrary commands. That is practically a legalized RCE.

that is not an model issue but a harness one, if you don't want it to have io to files or run command then simple don't give it access to the tools.

Re: Qwen3.8-Max: A New Bar for Coding and Cowork

#240

Post by necovek »

twelve40 wrote: post #91
dmix wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sam drank the "superintelligence" kool aid early on and said 30-40% of jobs could be impacted by AI, but recently admitted he was wrong > “My scorecard, at the highest level, would be we’ve been roughly right on technological predictions and pretty wrong on the social and economic implications” https://www.cxtoday.com/ai-automation-in-cx/sam-altman-softe... I agree re: Dario quietly pushing for government control. He…

but this crap may take forever to play out even if the outcome is well-known. Self-driving is "here", it's obvious that once it's cheap enough having a human behind a car wheel or a freight truck wheel is an absurd waste of human life (kinda like digging canals with bare hands instead of an excavator), yet truckers and uber drivers are still employed. But everyone knows the writing is on the wall for them.

Is it? I believe it is fair to hope so and even expect it, but this has been promised as being just around the corner for 10+ years.

Yet here we are, still driving our own cars, and laughing at silly behavior of most advanced self-driving systems.

I am certain we'll get to something of similar value, but I expect we'll have to improve infrastructure too (smart roads).

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