Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Australia's social media ban has failed

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 134 posts

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#61

Post by ares623 »

Skyy93 wrote: post #10
ares623 wrote: post #2

Ban the hardware, not the software.

So, are you suggesting that the legal use of smartphones should be banned for anyone under the age of 18? What kind of society do you want to live in?

There are degrees to it. The current problem has a "perfect storm" aspect to it, with multiple pieces working together in perfect harmony.

1. a "small" device that a person can use while moving

2. cheap/free internet access (wifi and/or mobile data)

3. high fidelity display with high refresh rate

4. a camera (I would probably group this together with 3)

Disabling 2 or 3 of those would short circuit the delivery mechanism of the "opioid" while still allowing the device to fulfill its more "useful" purposes.

Examples:

- A small internet device without a hi-res display _and_ a camera is still useful for "knowledge at your fingertips", communication, navigation, payments, etc.

- A device with a hi-res display, with a camera, with internet access, but not "small" is either a laptop or a tablet. That breaks the mechanism of one-half of social media addiction, which is the capability to instantly create and upload content right on the spot. (Although I would argue a tablet will still have that problem)

- A camera that doesn't have internet access can still allow a user to record events, but uploading the content will have to be delayed to a later time. A fair trade-off in my opinion.

And this is all possible with current hardware, by extending Parental Controls to disable the camera, and/or internet access, and/or handicapping the beautiful crown jewel displays.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#62

Post by grebc »

Skyy93 wrote: post #19
grebc wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, all the parents I know and have discussed this with are desperate for this to work. How it should work I'm unsure in the big scheme of it, but we limit access to various things until age 18 here in Australia, and I think this is one long term battle that I believe the tech sector will lose.

Rather than applying more bans, perhaps we should consider ways of living that allow parents to spend time talking to their children. Understanding what their days are like and the problems they face. For me much of this discussion and the excessive demand it takes from parents sounds more like a problem of the society as whole. That we are not having enough time to raise children since both parents are forced to wor…

I don't understand what you're trying to say sorry.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#63

Post by grebc »

intothemild wrote: post #12

I've said this to every single person who pushed for this. "Imagine you're a teenager, and your parents and government tell you to not do something... What will happen?" The answer is of course that they keep doing it anyhow. But hide it. As an Aussie, and a parent. What I wanted was that the government mandate that in order for your website or app to launch in Australia, that if you want to allow kids between certai…

They're providing for lowest common denominator.

You already said you've got your own solution.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#64

Post by ares623 »

Cider9986 wrote: post #25
tgv wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A smart phone is a human right, according to you? Of course you can ban them. The addicts will have to wean off, but after that, there's no disadvantage.

Considering it's how many people engage in speech, yes.

And look where that has taken us. Perhaps that was true for the last few decades. But now that period is over, and our ability to exercise our right and to coordinate without it has atrophied to our great detriment.

And then we look at AI and think "surely this time it will be different"

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#65

Post by Skyy93 »

grebc wrote: post #62
Skyy93 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than applying more bans, perhaps we should consider ways of living that allow parents to spend time talking to their children. Understanding what their days are like and the problems they face. For me much of this discussion and the excessive demand it takes from parents sounds more like a problem of the society as whole. That we are not having enough time to raise children since both parents are forced to wor…

I don't understand what you're trying to say sorry.

My proposition is that parents should have more time for their children. If they would have more time with them, they could fix issues and show to their children how to live a better life instead of becoming a social media controlled zombie. Someone else in this thread mentioned that obesity should be fixed first, different issue, same solution. Since parents are expect from our current society to work both over 40 hours a week they can not, and will not, educate their child. Since they can not they search for the simple solution that someone else has to do it and impose laws to solve the problem.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#66

Post by Skyy93 »

defrost wrote: post #53
Skyy93 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why not the one 1895? Some people seem to prefer this as well, but you perhaps would not like it. If you prefer living without a smartphone its completly up to you and I would always stand for your right to not have one, but on the other side I am also standing for the right to have one if someone desires one.

Are you also standing up for the right of 12 year olds to access porn and graphic violence though? That's a somewhat loaded question, I'll assume you're not (correct me if I'm wrong) and move on to the question of should 12 year olds have smartphones and if so how should they limit access to porn and graphic violence when used by 12 year olds? Please don't fob this off by requiring that all parents should have CS deg…

I think this is a very funny question. Since different countries seem to answer this very differently.

In countries like the US the first Season of The Walking Dead was aired with an age rating of TV-14. At the same time the same in Germany this season was rated with an Rating of 18 (Germany uses 0,6,12,18 as ages for rating). So I am somewhat puzzled. Similar when a movie shows a pair of boobs or at least implies some sexual elements the US tend to rate the movie often with their MA-rating. However, in Germany thats different. It seems we have different children in both countries. As the ones in the US are more okay with violence and it does not affect them, where the childs in Germany are more okay with sexual elements.

This was just an example how stupid many rating systems are, their are very dependent on the country and the society you live in. So there is no inherent universalism to what a 12 or a 14 or a 16 year old should see or not.

My point, and I tried to argue this multiple times in this post, is that a goverment should not simply impose more and more bans and restrictions. This seems like the easy way out, but has always drawbacks. One is already described in the article, namely that the parents already start loosing awareness that the internet might be a dangerous place. Since they think: Yeah, there is a ban so its solved!

We should rather give the parents the time such that they can communicate often enough with their child to understand what problems its facing. In what kind of world the child lives and what they are consuming. If both parents are working 40 hours+ each week, they are not able to do this. Someone also mentioned in this thread "why is obesity not first fixed.", it might be a different issue, but the solution is the same. More time for parents mean that they can cook more healthy meals and do not rely on garbage food because they are stressed out.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#67

Post by Skyy93 »

ShinyLeftPad wrote: post #58
Skyy93 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than applying more bans, perhaps we should consider ways of living that allow parents to spend time talking to their children. Understanding what their days are like and the problems they face. For me much of this discussion and the excessive demand it takes from parents sounds more like a problem of the society as whole. That we are not having enough time to raise children since both parents are forced to wor…

I know! How about new technology that "automates" stuff, letting them pay us lower wages to work more hours (if we're lucky to keep a job)? Maybe it should even be trained on our work

This feels a bit like whatboutism. While the transition might be hard this will sort out if it comes to that point. You (and in a possible future the AI) are producing stuff for people to consume. If no one is consuming stuff you earn no money and there is no reason to produce. So you want people to have money such that they can spend it.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#68

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

Here's a revolutionary idea.

Instead of mandates, why not lower the tax burden on citizens. That would give move freedom to parents to decide not to work, and actually, parent their kids.

Don't force parents to both be absent from home because the burden of the bureaucracy salaries is too great without sucking blood from the middle class

Houses don't need to cost 0.5M AUD with long mortgages that force 2 parents to work. They cost that because the government is spending like a drunken sailor and destroying the value of money held by everyday australians.

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#69

Post by grebc »

stavros wrote: post #13
grebc wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, all the parents I know and have discussed this with are desperate for this to work. How it should work I'm unsure in the big scheme of it, but we limit access to various things until age 18 here in Australia, and I think this is one long term battle that I believe the tech sector will lose.

I got bullied at school, but I'm not sure the solution would be to not let anyone in school talk to me :/

They're not stopping anyone from physically talking to you(what's important).

They're stopping you/others from sending DM's/Tags/Meme's(what isn't important).

Re: Australia's social media ban has failed

#70

Post by defrost »

pibaker wrote: post #60
defrost wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you also standing up for the right of 12 year olds to access porn and graphic violence though? That's a somewhat loaded question, I'll assume you're not (correct me if I'm wrong) and move on to the question of should 12 year olds have smartphones and if so how should they limit access to porn and graphic violence when used by 12 year olds? Please don't fob this off by requiring that all parents should have CS deg…

Do you think 12yos have a right to stab each other to death? Why don't you support a knife ban if you don't want this to happen?

No.

What if I were in the UK and supported the UK's zombie knife bans and general principle of police right to stop and question people carry knives?

You seem to be making assumptions here.

Post reply on HN