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EU now fears US interference in European elections

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41–50 of 62 posts

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#41
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Hm, why don't we ask people who know what they're talking about? How about, idk, Yale professors that focus on fascism and its rise? Surely they'd be able to give us an informed opinion?

What's that? They've decided to leave the country? Huh.

https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000010157022/yale-c...

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#42
post #41
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Hm, why don't we ask people who know what they're talking about? How about, idk, Yale professors that focus on fascism and its rise? Surely they'd be able to give us an informed opinion? What's that? They've decided to leave the country? Huh. https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000010157022/yale-c...

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Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#43
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are driven by conservative media explaining to them the enemy is the other (brown, or trans, or plain woman) instead of the ruling class.

You can't imagine any situation where the people are seeing this for themselves? It must be that they're brainwashed by conservative media?

Of course there are. But how many people were brainwashed by Fox News in the US, various tabloids in the UK, the Bolloré media empire in France, etc. ? My guess is it's there huge majority of them. Like in any part of the world, take some unhappy people (mostly poor but not only), you have a very fertile ground for your readymade enemy stories.

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#44
post #42
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hm, why don't we ask people who know what they're talking about? How about, idk, Yale professors that focus on fascism and its rise? Surely they'd be able to give us an informed opinion? What's that? They've decided to leave the country? Huh. https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000010157022/yale-c...

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When you call studying the rise of fascism and trying to prevent it "leftist ideology" and then try to prevent that whole line of inquiry, I think that kind of proves my point, no?

And yes, no shit, they don't like the guy who is doing the fascist things, that's kind of the whole focus of their study.

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#45
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a lazy comment. How is the EU changing? How is it changing to be closer to which part of South America? South America is changing so do you mean how it was or are they converging? The EU has expanded in the last 40 years but I don't imagine that's what you mean. What do you mean?

Basically, losing any sense of autonomy and becoming US's hinterland. It has moved a lot in this direction from an economic and geopolitical PoV over the past 40 years, now we're seeing the electoral process being subverted by American interests.

Western Europe was much more integrated with the US during the Cold War than it was at any time after 1990 (just as Eastern Europe was thightly integrated with the USSR), and that process of disentanglement with the US has accelerated dramatically once the US decided to start the process of turning itself into a fascist autocracy (its quite similar with Eastern Europe disentangling from the post-USSR actually, just that Western Europe is about 30 years late to the party).

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#46
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't imagine any situation where the people are seeing this for themselves? It must be that they're brainwashed by conservative media?

Of course there are. But how many people were brainwashed by Fox News in the US, various tabloids in the UK, the Bolloré media empire in France, etc. ? My guess is it's there huge majority of them. Like in any part of the world, take some unhappy people (mostly poor but not only), you have a very fertile ground for your readymade enemy stories.

Just last week in Europe we had - Islamist ramming a vehicle in pride parade in Berlin and Islamist stabbing in France - in which three women were seriously hurt.

Do you claim that those didn't happen, were exaggerated or invented out of thin air from the media to brainwash the hoi polloi?

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#47
post #33

As a UK citizen, it's interesting to think back to Barack Obama's attempt to convince the country not to vote for Brexit (saying the UK would "go to the back of the line" for future trade deal negotiations). I think the real difference now, isn't so much that the US is applying more pressure on european politics, but that it's politics is so much further away from most european countries than even five years ago. The…

Vance's support of Orbán; Musk's support of Reform, AfD, and other far-right parties across Europe; Thiel's shadow interference through his "gatherings" with other countries' elites while being explicitly anti-democracy. Many other oligarchs are likely involved with different levels of visibility and effort for this push, I wouldn't be surprised if Zuck is part of it by providing the machinery of social media while k…

Also, recent: "Trump administration to fund Maga-aligned projects in Europe as he reorders US aid, FT reports" https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/trump-adminis...

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#49
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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The US is certainly far closer to so called ‘illiberal democracy’ (ie., not a democracy, but maintains some of the aesthetic of democracy) than it used to be. It probably hasn’t entirely tipped over the precipice yet, but it’s extremely naive to think that the current situation is anything like business as usual.

Re: EU now fears US interference in European elections

#50
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically, losing any sense of autonomy and becoming US's hinterland. It has moved a lot in this direction from an economic and geopolitical PoV over the past 40 years, now we're seeing the electoral process being subverted by American interests.

Western Europe was much more integrated with the US during the Cold War than it was at any time after 1990 (just as Eastern Europe was thightly integrated with the USSR), and that process of disentanglement with the US has accelerated dramatically once the US decided to start the process of turning itself into a fascist autocracy (its quite similar with Eastern Europe disentangling from the post-USSR actually, just t…

> Western Europe was much more integrated with the US during the Cold War than it was at any time after 1990

Not quite. For instance no European countries got involved in Vietnam like they did in Iraq (twice) and Afghanistan, and France had left Nato integrated command in the 60s, only to join again in 2009.

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