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Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

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Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#51

Post by HelloMcFly »

mvidal01 wrote: post #28
tmoertel wrote: post #20

Mountain mints are also pollinated by beetles—and a bazillion other critters. They are extraordinary pollinator magnets. Beetles, bees, flies, wasps, mosquitos (!), moths, butterflies, ... A recent study of just a few mountain mint species ( https://doi.org/10.1080/00222933.2024.2411072 ) found that they attracted a crazy variety of pollinators. Check the supplementary materials for the full list.

I have mountain mint growing in my yard and every pollinator imaginable goes to that plant.

I have slender mountain mint and it used to be a popular pollinator spot... until I planted figwort. Never had anything get action like the figwort!

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#52

Post by mallomarmeasle »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #44
chabes wrote: post #2

A lot of plants aren’t pollinated by bees. There’s pollinator wasps, flies, moths, butterflies… even birds and bats are pollinators

My pawpaws (Asimina triloba) mainly need (house) flies to pollinate. They make their flowers look like meat. I have a couple 100 foot rows of them, it's tricky to get good pollination.

My grandpappy told me that if you want a good crop of pawpaws you have to hang a dead cat in the tree. I think dead cats were in greater supply back in his day.

Fascinating flowers for a tree though. Red meat color and odor only a fly could love.

For anyone that’s close, go to the upcoming Ohio Pawpaw festival! https://ohiopawpawfest.com/

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#53

Post by VMG »

rob74 wrote: post #26
chabes wrote: post #2

A lot of plants aren’t pollinated by bees. There’s pollinator wasps, flies, moths, butterflies… even birds and bats are pollinators

One of those moths is this guy, who (in flight, not so much in still images) looks and sounds like a miniature hummingbird: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummingbird_hawk-moth

rare instance where the German name Taubenschwänzchen ('little dove-tail') is nicer than the English name

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#54

Post by cmrdporcupine »

adm4 wrote: post #46
cmrdporcupine wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My pawpaws (Asimina triloba) mainly need (house) flies to pollinate. They make their flowers look like meat. I have a couple 100 foot rows of them, it's tricky to get good pollination.

the little beetle that could, and pawpaw's are self-incompatible. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asimina_triloba#Pollination

plenty of sap beetles around here, but i don't tend to see them on my pawpaws. they come around later season when my raspberries ripen

would not rule out the cash crop farming on both sides of me from doing a number on the insects, though i seem to have plenty overall.

unfortunately an excessive number of japanese beetles

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#55

Post by mark_something »

teh_klev wrote: post #43

These are the original articles this re-heat was created from: - https://www.zmescience.com/science/news-science/magnolias-be... - https://gardens.si.edu/learn/blog/the-botany-of-magnolias/

Thanks. The first article has more info, e.g. that those beetles are flightless.

But that makes me suspect that they spend a lot of time on one tree, only pollinating that tree, which would be pointless because there is no exchange of genes.

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#56

Post by rags2riches »

baxtr wrote: post #39
mvidal01 wrote: post #32

Some insects gather nectar from a flower and don't pollinate the flower. This is called nectar robbing. See https://www.backyardecology.net/not-all-flower-visitors-are-...

What’s the best security control against this robbery?!

This is what the shape of the flower and its placement of the stamen and pistils are all about.

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#57

Post by dr_dshiv »

mark_something wrote: post #55
teh_klev wrote: post #43

These are the original articles this re-heat was created from: - https://www.zmescience.com/science/news-science/magnolias-be... - https://gardens.si.edu/learn/blog/the-botany-of-magnolias/

Thanks. The first article has more info, e.g. that those beetles are flightless. But that makes me suspect that they spend a lot of time on one tree, only pollinating that tree, which would be pointless because there is no exchange of genes.

The desperation of the immobile

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#58

Post by xipho »

adrian_b wrote: post #36
TacticalMalice wrote: post #11

The earliest angiosperms appeared in the Cretaceous. This is after the appearance of Hymenoptera (Jurassic) and Diptera (Triassic). While a nice story, this needs additional substantiation. An alternative explanation is likelier imo.

The early Hymenoptera were predatory, like wasps still are. Bees, which feed on pollen and nectar from plant flowers, instead of catching other insects, have evolved much later from wasp-like Hymenoptera, after angiosperms were already widespread. So the timeline fits into the story.

> were predatory ... ?

Were they? Sawflies are herbivores, and are at minimum share a common ancestor with those that were not herbivores.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096098221...

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#59

Post by WhyIsItAlwaysHN »

adrian_b wrote: post #40
WhyIsItAlwaysHN wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spiders are not insects though https://www.burkemuseum.org/collections-and-research/biology...

Restricting the word "insects" to hexapods is a modern convention that does not have any basis in etymology. Aristotle used the word "insects" for all terrestrial arthropods and this was followed for millennia until the last two centuries when someone preferred to use "Insecta" instead of "Hexapoda", without giving any reason for this, and others followed this taxonomy. Even so, the exact extent of the term "insects"…

This is a discussion about animal intelligence. Jumping spiders have a different brain layout than bees, which are formally insects. Other insects are more like the bee than spiders.

So in this case, it matters that spiders are not in fact insects in the strict sense.

Re: Magnolias are so old that they're pollinated by beetles, not bees (2025)

#60

Post by 317070 »

rob74 wrote: post #26
chabes wrote: post #2

A lot of plants aren’t pollinated by bees. There’s pollinator wasps, flies, moths, butterflies… even birds and bats are pollinators

One of those moths is this guy, who (in flight, not so much in still images) looks and sounds like a miniature hummingbird: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummingbird_hawk-moth

For many people, it is the other way around. It is very remarkable that there is a bird, which looks so much like a big version of this butterfly!

After all, in Europe these butterflies are commonplace, but I've never seen the American bird in my life.

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