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Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

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Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU Chip industry : ASML, 2nd to only nvidia, 0.5T mkt cap

They sell the shovels, we need someone actually digging for gold.

Shovels have always been the better out of the two investments.

There were rumours about China grabbing hold of one of ASML's machines, but with no additional information on this it's safe to assume they're still hammering out 7nm chips using DUV at piss poor yields.

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#62
post #9

Prediction - we are going to figure out SOTA AI performance without requiring 1TB of memory within a year or so. Of course CXMT, Micron, and family will still be profitable, but maybe not 'surge 470% from IPO' profitable.

How would we do that? There's no historic precedent for that. Its fundamentally an information theory thing: what's the max amount of intelligence you can get out of 1 KB/MB/GB? There has to be a limit and I'm not convinced that it's far off.

> How would we do that? There's no historic precedent for that. Its fundamentally an information theory thing: what's the max amount of intelligence you can get out of 1 KB/MB/GB? There has to be a limit and I'm not convinced that it's far off.

Sure, it might be very near using the current approach, but... it might also be might be very far off because we are using the wrong approach.

I mean, look at the max amount of intelligence you can get out of a human brain powered by two bananas...

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would we do that? There's no historic precedent for that. Its fundamentally an information theory thing: what's the max amount of intelligence you can get out of 1 KB/MB/GB? There has to be a limit and I'm not convinced that it's far off.

It doesn't matter. However much intelligence you can squeeze into 1 GB, people will always want more. Standard Def TV was plenty for 50 years. But when more was on offer, everyone went for it, and now you can't even buy a 480p TV.

> Standard Def TV was plenty for 50 years. But when more was on offer, everyone went for it, and now you can't even buy a 480p TV.

And yet when we hit 4k, that's were people just stopped buying higher res. 8K is still useful, but only when the screen is so large that it doesn't fit in the room :-/

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#65
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter. However much intelligence you can squeeze into 1 GB, people will always want more. Standard Def TV was plenty for 50 years. But when more was on offer, everyone went for it, and now you can't even buy a 480p TV.

Your example also counters your point: A lot of people do not care about 4k, and even less do care about 8k or above. We reached a point where most people are completely happy with the quality they get.

Likely constrained by the fact people are mostly watching low bitrate Netflix streams.

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#67
post #9

Prediction - we are going to figure out SOTA AI performance without requiring 1TB of memory within a year or so. Of course CXMT, Micron, and family will still be profitable, but maybe not 'surge 470% from IPO' profitable.

SoTA AI will move well past 1TB+ memory requirements in 1 year or so.

Also, you will be able to play with much more competent models locally. They will still feel like children compared to the adults living in the SoTA region.

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#68
post #9

Prediction - we are going to figure out SOTA AI performance without requiring 1TB of memory within a year or so. Of course CXMT, Micron, and family will still be profitable, but maybe not 'surge 470% from IPO' profitable.

How would we do that? There's no historic precedent for that. Its fundamentally an information theory thing: what's the max amount of intelligence you can get out of 1 KB/MB/GB? There has to be a limit and I'm not convinced that it's far off.

All the terms are squishy, but being sloppy about it, I think there's intelligence that needs to be in the model, and knowledge that could live in a database. Right now, models are memorizing a lot of stuff they don't need to. We know how to index lots of information on (comparatively slow) SSDs or across a network.

See Karpathy's "Cognitive Core" idea. (I don't have a good link)

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#69
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter. However much intelligence you can squeeze into 1 GB, people will always want more. Standard Def TV was plenty for 50 years. But when more was on offer, everyone went for it, and now you can't even buy a 480p TV.

Your example also counters your point: A lot of people do not care about 4k, and even less do care about 8k or above. We reached a point where most people are completely happy with the quality they get.

> Your example also counters your point: A lot of people do not care about 4k, and even less do care about 8k or above. We reached a point where most people are completely happy with the quality they get.

And when (not if) we get to the 4k (or 8k) equivalent of LLMs, they'll just be baked into hardware and we'll have near instant responses while running locally.

There is no future where OpenAI, Anthropic, etc survive with their current business model; at some point we will hit a point where training a new model is done only every 5 years or so, and in that scenario we aren't going to be running models of pricey server GPUs with latencies measured in seconds and full responses measured in minutes.

We'll be running locally with sub-millisecond latencies and responses measured in milliseconds. There is no way for any big company to compete with the current business plan of selling inference or subscriptions.

Re: Chinese chipmaker shares surge 470%

#70
post #49
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 8% to 9% of the worldwide DRAM market share in 2025 how much more do they need to ship to satisfy you?

10x

Seems fair ... if they can capture (and ship) 90% of the global supply of memory they will be permitted to have a market cap of 0.1x Nvidia.
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