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Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

swag.htmx.org

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Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#101

Post by _jackdk_ »

mlhpdx wrote: post #99
blister wrote: post #6

I've been using htmx for three years now, and it's completely unlocked new ways of building software for the web, especially if you use a server-side templating language. But more importantly (as this "Game Boy" option reveals), the head honcho is really responsive with the items in the store. I had purchased a coffee mug a few years back and complained on Twitter that they need to sell larger mugs instead of only of…

Likewise, I started using HTMX with AWS Step Functions as the backend and it’s been difficult but also a joy. Sfn these days makes for a weird and wild text templating engine. I’ve been thinking about working on DSL overlay to smooth the bumps a bit.

That is not a use cases I would've expected Step Functions to handle; I'm intrigued. You're using express ones, I assume, but how are you wiring them up and why?

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#103

Post by cure_42 »

inigyou wrote: post #74
scumdude wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell me about it. I made a joke about the store selling 'Complexity Bad' onesies, and he started selling them later that day. https://x.com/scumitchell/status/1886825775560528069?s=20

This implies it's all dropshipped print-on-demand, of course. Which is fine if you're just considering it a donation incentive rather than a worthwhile product in its own right.

Yeah I had the same thought. I was vaguely interested before, but I have no desire to own more garbage

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#104

Post by beepbooptheory »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #93

What I don't like about Htmx is, that it is still a JS framework, without good automatic fallbacks for a noscript situation. This leads to web devs thinking it would be great to do all the things in Htmx, even if all they have is a static page with static content. Just recently I looked at hosting an old school forum. I don't want to load all the PHP and MySQL baggage on my server or even run it in docker, so I looke…

I get the point but I do feel like Htmx's whole design is a big automatic fallback... If some browsers will never be able to understand the hx-get/post/etc attribs, you can just design the initial html you send over around that.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#105

Post by rtpg »

beepbooptheory wrote: post #104
zelphirkalt wrote: post #93

What I don't like about Htmx is, that it is still a JS framework, without good automatic fallbacks for a noscript situation. This leads to web devs thinking it would be great to do all the things in Htmx, even if all they have is a static page with static content. Just recently I looked at hosting an old school forum. I don't want to load all the PHP and MySQL baggage on my server or even run it in docker, so I looke…

I get the point but I do feel like Htmx's whole design is a big automatic fallback... If some browsers will never be able to understand the hx-get/post/etc attribs, you can just design the initial html you send over around that.

while what you're saying is true in theory, you still have to make sure that e.g. your form responses do the right thing. You might think "just return the full page!" but it's extra work that for many people is busywork, and makes it harder to reuse things ("my comment post endpoint returns the rendered comment" becomes "my comment post endpoint needs to know what page the comment is in to return the fully rendered page")

In practice I think it's very easy to make your htmx application JS-requiring.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#106

Post by Grimblewald »

blister wrote: post #6

I've been using htmx for three years now, and it's completely unlocked new ways of building software for the web, especially if you use a server-side templating language. But more importantly (as this "Game Boy" option reveals), the head honcho is really responsive with the items in the store. I had purchased a coffee mug a few years back and complained on Twitter that they need to sell larger mugs instead of only of…

It's been massive for me as well. I would say my web developmemt is best described as dabbling in web development, and I mostly do so for websites that cater to academic interests and conference / society managment and organising. So, relativly niche.

However, I think HTMX is a beauty. Fast, simple, and doesnt come with all the bloat and BS a JS heavy / JS first deployment comes with. I can quikckly build fast and responsive sites that cost visitors very little to use/interact with.

websites have less compatability issues now, load extremely fast (google web speed score from 60-80 to flat 100), and have fewer points of failure. Debugging is a breeze. Websites are no less pretty or useful for it. In fact, they look better now because time otherwise wasted on Js BS is now free to use to tinker with / improve aesthetic, or add new features.

I'm in love with HTMX. It feels like what the web should have always been. There's absolutly zero reason a random website, without my knowledge or consent, should be running extremely heavy compute and analytics on my own device. That should never have been possible/permissible in the first place.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#107

Post by threecheese »

antihero wrote: post #5
rpdillon wrote: post #2

HTMX's whole vibe is amazing. It's good tech, kept simple, useful in gobs of situations, but doesn't take itself too seriously. I've used it in professional and side projects since intercooler.js, and still love it. Here's a crazy unicorn-laser-eyes mug[0] that evokes the vibes of NROL-39[1]. I adore it. [0]: https://swag.htmx.org/collections/octohorse [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA-247

I was against it for ages but having have claude use it in a simple project and being frankly sick/bored of React, it seems nice.

Any comments on how you’re holding it? Just “Hey Claude use htmx”?

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#108

Post by mlhpdx »

_jackdk_ wrote: post #101
mlhpdx wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Likewise, I started using HTMX with AWS Step Functions as the backend and it’s been difficult but also a joy. Sfn these days makes for a weird and wild text templating engine. I’ve been thinking about working on DSL overlay to smooth the bumps a bit.

That is not a use cases I would've expected Step Functions to handle; I'm intrigued. You're using express ones, I assume, but how are you wiring them up and why?

API Gateway direct integration to Step Functions. Unlike Lambda, there is not automatic transform for requests so I just wrote one and copy/paste it to each method integration (via a preprocess script; one of the ugly bits). Yes, EXPRESS state machines. I’ve found they have better tail latency behavior, and of course they involve zero patching/dependency updates which is nice.

The state machines use JSONata for the sweet, sweet power vs JSONPath. Generally I have a Parallel state that splits the different parts of the page and Map states for data driven repetition (usually some data pulled from DDB). I have a simple JSONata method for replacing placeholder values (aka data binding). Zero Lambda at the cost of come copy paste.

I’m not unhappy with it despite the warts.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#110

Post by rtpg »

nasretdinov wrote: post #22
throw2ih020 wrote: post #16

HTMX is awesome. I've replaced several OSS web apps on my home server with HTMX + Go + PostgreSQL replacements. The results are lightweight, responsive, work great on desktop and mobile alike, all with the absolute minimum complexity required. The codebases are easy to understand and modify, and so far I'm going months between updates (mostly just minor bugfixes for my applications). I fully expec my mature apps will…

That's great but I believe it's still over-engineered. Unless it's a web site that can tolerate no downtime at all during schema updates, SQLite in WAL2 mode is more than enough. Moreover, in Postgres version upgrades can't be done without significant downtime (or setting up replication and performing a complex dance), so even that isn't so cut and dry.

> Unless it's a web site that can tolerate no downtime at all during schema updates, SQLite in WAL2 mode is more than enough.

I do think that people really underestimate how quickly a system starts being "please, no downtime" (or its weaker cousin, "please, don't make your ops people do rollouts at 1AM").

Like obviously it's not the end of the world but the default assumption of "the system is up" makes a loooooot of things downstream of that easier.

Having to do operational bug triage on systems that routinely have blips in availability is unfun.

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