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I regret migrating to Codeberg

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Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#391

Post by lelanthran »

chasd00 wrote: post #274
lelanthran wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think, perhaps, my point is that at this rate, pretty soon there won't be any non-vibed projects. Even those devs that are currently overseeing are gradually atrophying their critical thinking skills in this space.

Does that mean codeberg has just guaranteed its own demise?

> Does that mean codeberg has just guaranteed its own demise?

In industry, certainly. The free-because-it's-a-hobby crowd will still be well served by Codeberg.

Much like how you can get very cheap mass-manufactured furniture, but some people still build their own tables and chairs.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#392

Post by hedora »

treyd wrote: post #388
hedora wrote: post #385

So, I guess Codeberg doesn't meet the free software bar any more. The FSF defines four freedoms, and they are all pretty clearly being violated by the no LLM policy. They're blocking people based on how they use codeberg (freedom 0), preventing less experienced users from improving / modifying code (freedom 1), based on an argument that you can modify software, but only how they tell you to, and certainly not with an…

Codeberg is a service, not software. If we applied this standard then Codeberg would already have been in violation of the 4 Freedoms because they forbid distribution of CSAM (I would hope). Forgejo is unaffected by this because it's the software not the service and is not subject to the service's terms of service. You're misunderstanding the scope of this policy change.

I tried to address this when I pointed out no SaaS meets the bar in absolute terms, and the FSF also addressed it with the word "adequately".

The policy change means that some free software projects are no longer welcome on codeberg, specifically because those projects take a stronger stance towards protecting free software than codeberg.

What am I misunderstanding? Why should I trust them as stewards of forgejo?

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#394

Post by jraph »

throwayay4929 wrote: post #366
ngcazz wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"nice things" you mean upholding the harm of the status quo by not criticizing it

So youre proposing that everyone should always be criticizing every unjust thing in the world or else they're upholding the status quo? By that silly logic I guess codeberg is supporting the uyghur genocide because they don't mention it.

Until proven otherwise, Codeberg's operations have nothing to do with the uyghur genocide though.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#395

Post by consumer451 »

hedora wrote: post #385

So, I guess Codeberg doesn't meet the free software bar any more. The FSF defines four freedoms, and they are all pretty clearly being violated by the no LLM policy. They're blocking people based on how they use codeberg (freedom 0), preventing less experienced users from improving / modifying code (freedom 1), based on an argument that you can modify software, but only how they tell you to, and certainly not with an…

I am not well informed on this Codeberg story, but could this simply be a way for them to avoid some of the destructive loads that GitHub has been experiencing since "vibe coding" became a thing? Maybe the code origin purity test is just a way to explain it?

It appears to be just that:

> The vote follows ongoing efforts by Codeberg to prevent automated software (bots) from taxing its infrastructure with excessive network requests. Authors Bastian Greshake Tzovaras, Otto Richter, and William Zijl argue that AI companies are shifting costs to others and damaging online communities in the process.

https://www.theregister.com/ai-and-ml/2026/07/23/codeberg-gi...

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#396

Post by cmrdporcupine »

mcv wrote: post #63
Aachen wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So I voted against, partly because I feel that the text doesn't to justice to such a multifaceted topic. If all projects on Codeberg were human-written, that would be a big seal of quality! There are a lot of projects coming out now where someone feels like they've made a cool thing but it breaks on the first edge case and is entirely unmaintainable. Many are built on wrong principles because the prompt authors aren'…

> imagine LLMs got twice as good as they are today) I have no idea how you'd quantify that, but they're pretty good already. At least in the hands of someone who knows what they're doing. I share everybody's concern about many aspects of LLMs; copyright, data collection, energy use, component prices, not to mention what it does to us: outsourcing our thinking, dependency, slop. And I don't entirely disagree wanting t…

> No idea where yet; I don't want to go to Github, and I believe there were similar concerns about Gitlab, so I don't know where to go yet.

FWIW I just gave up and went back to GitHub. Not because I like it. I hate the organization.

But having been burned with the year long diversion through Codeberg, and actually caring about getting eyes and contributions on my project, I have no appetite for playing more games here and ending up back in the same situation in another year.

I could self-host, and I'm willing to front that cost. But it would be frankly at the cost of getting eyeballs and contributions. And come with hassle to boot.

I already had a read only mirror to GH from codeberg anyways.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#397

Post by CaptainFever »

hedora wrote: post #377
m4rtink wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole Fedora infrastructure shows the default cute Anubis character (while protecting said infrastructure from AI scrappers) & I don't see any problems with that. :)

Is there a bypass for those yet? Not all of the machines I have run it at a reasonable pace, so I'd like to just farm the challenge to some other machine. My nice desktop that I use for C++/Rust/Formal Verification takes multiple minutes sometimes, and I'd rather not replace the motherboard over this, or figure out why it's not using the GPU/whatever. OTOH, I have a MacBook with Apple's terrible window manager. It bl…

It exists. Search up POW blocker or Anubis blocker extensions.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#398

Post by hedora »

ElFitz wrote: post #55
kps wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I moved my projects to Codeberg 3 years ago because it promoted itself as a host for FOSS, and I was starting to think that GitHub was not going to remain a dependable FOSS host. All of mine are one-man itch-scratching that I am willing to share with others. None so far contain any LLM-assisted work. A couple weeks ago I froze them, when https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48842611 came up. Not because of the LLM po…

That thread is fascinating, to say the least.

This quote really sticks out (it's arguing against sticking with free software's core principles):

> bwahahahahahaha are u gonna preach “no politics” now too. free software is inherently dogmatic, screw playing centrist

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#399

Post by skinfaxi »

rpdillon wrote: post #355
skinfaxi wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even human effort is a terrible proxy because effort is a gradient that depends on skill. An expert exerts low effort for the same result a novice would labor over.

That's a good point. I think the core metric is somehow quality, but that's notoriously difficult to measure.

I recall having this same exact discussion with my philosophy professor years ago. We all know there is something different about a hand cooked meal and say putting a tablet in a box and a fully cooked meal comes out for you.

I feel like it may be closer to attention? That's the thing we actually value, that someone took the time and put in the effort to do something. And the quality depends on how much we value that attention. Like high effort low quality is praised when it's the work product of your child for instance.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#400

Post by hedora »

akkartik wrote: post #48
BoxwoodSeed wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it endearing that someone is keeping up the resistance against JavaScript. Used things like noscript myself since 2008 or so. Eventually gave up since nearly no website would work that way and served you captcha loops instead.

I still use NoScript. I actually started in 2018. I will turn on 1 or 2 js sites for a respectable looking page, but blank screens and captchas are a good signal to bounce, or occasionally to use an incognito window which enables all JS. As the web gets more hostile (2018 was so much worse than 2008) NoScript will be more competitive in spite of all the inconvenience.

How do you browse cloudflare + anubis sites like that?

(Asking because they've both become routine problems for me with most browsers, probably since I disable cookies + run an ad blocker).

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