Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

I regret migrating to Codeberg

xn--gckvb8fzb.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

351–360 of 617 posts

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#351

Post by rpdillon »

skinfaxi wrote: post #332
customguy wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And as long as it's hand-made, that's fine.

What is hand made code? Does that mean no auto complete? No linters?

People downvote this kind of take because you're striking at the heart of the enforcement problem and also the definition of what a project that is majority built with AI really means. What they really want is to ascertain the amount of effort from a human that went into the project and they're using the percentage of code generated by an AI as a proxy metric. But it's a bad proxy, both because it doesn't capture human effort and because it is not measurable.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#352

Post by rpdillon »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #324
hibikir wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if you can reasonably separate LLM from non LLM code, which is in no way a solved problem. Even if one agrees with their priorities 100%, it's just asking for non-automated enforcement. It's difficult to execute, and either lead to completely arbitrary enforcement, or a lot of resources being spent in exchange for this freedom you mention. It's just a very hard practical line to try to draw. And let's be real, m…

It's true that an LLM ban is really hard to enforce, but that doesn't mean it's worthless. If i make an image editor and say "It is my policy that serial killers and pedophiles cannot use my software" i can't really enforce that, but it still makes a (somewhat useless) statement. In my opinion, not allowing LLM code at least signals that codeberg (and forgejo) itself is unlikely to be majority LLM code, which raises…

> what kind of people the maintainers are.

Can you elaborate on this? It's new that we're judging what kind of people we're dealing with based on what tools they use.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#353

Post by skinfaxi »

rpdillon wrote: post #351
skinfaxi wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is hand made code? Does that mean no auto complete? No linters?

People downvote this kind of take because you're striking at the heart of the enforcement problem and also the definition of what a project that is majority built with AI really means. What they really want is to ascertain the amount of effort from a human that went into the project and they're using the percentage of code generated by an AI as a proxy metric. But it's a bad proxy, both because it doesn't capture hum…

Even human effort is a terrible proxy because effort is a gradient that depends on skill. An expert exerts low effort for the same result a novice would labor over.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#354

Post by rpdillon »

soapdog wrote: post #193
eviks wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does adding a few words to TOS stop "selfish bastards"?

Gives them a line to justify removing projects in the future if they are caught violating the ToS.

Do we have a tool that can detect whether a project is majority LLM-written? This is an unenforceable rule, unless it's just coming down to vibes and they're going to decide what projects to ban based on their feelings.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#355

Post by rpdillon »

skinfaxi wrote: post #353
rpdillon wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People downvote this kind of take because you're striking at the heart of the enforcement problem and also the definition of what a project that is majority built with AI really means. What they really want is to ascertain the amount of effort from a human that went into the project and they're using the percentage of code generated by an AI as a proxy metric. But it's a bad proxy, both because it doesn't capture hum…

Even human effort is a terrible proxy because effort is a gradient that depends on skill. An expert exerts low effort for the same result a novice would labor over.

That's a good point. I think the core metric is somehow quality, but that's notoriously difficult to measure.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#356

Post by customguy »

rpdillon wrote: post #351
skinfaxi wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is hand made code? Does that mean no auto complete? No linters?

People downvote this kind of take because you're striking at the heart of the enforcement problem and also the definition of what a project that is majority built with AI really means. What they really want is to ascertain the amount of effort from a human that went into the project and they're using the percentage of code generated by an AI as a proxy metric. But it's a bad proxy, both because it doesn't capture hum…

> People downvote this kind of take because you're striking at the heart of the enforcement problem

That's not your problem.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#357

Post by [deleted] »

chmod775 wrote: post #250

Keeping up with this stuff is for people who define their identity through virtue signalling and whatever personality trait they have decided to make the problem of everyone around them. Let them have their little corner of the internet and just stay away. There's plenty of alternatives run by people who don't feel the need to bring their personal baggage into a cooperative environment.

[deleted]

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#358

Post by pessimizer »

squigz wrote: post #295
throwayay4929 wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imaging where the world would be if Firefox, when it came out, went deep on the Iraq war? Or if RMS got involved in, I don't know, the Lewinsky affair in the 1990s, and made it a core part of the FSF? We'd all be using WinXP SE and IE6. "The personal is political" is a truly toxic idea that's been corroding nice things since it's inception.

Using RMS as an example of "how to not be political" is uh... interesting.

RMS headed a political organization, and kept his political campaigning to things directly related to the politics that his organization represented.

The people who were angry at RMS's "politics" were always actually mad at the concept of Free Software in general, and the fact that RMS thinks that software that is not Free is bad software (and does not think you are an exception.) He wasn't banging on about trans rights or Muslamic invasions, but people being enslaved by machines run by the powerful.

Doesn't mean that he didn't have opinions, he just knew why people cared what he thought. When he ventured a bad (but common) opinion about sleeping with teenagers, it opened a hole that his enemies drove a truck through. It's also notable that he did this to defend his friend Minsky; people often compromise their professionalism over personal relationships and interests.

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#359

Post by bigfishrunning »

rpdillon wrote: post #352
bigfishrunning wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's true that an LLM ban is really hard to enforce, but that doesn't mean it's worthless. If i make an image editor and say "It is my policy that serial killers and pedophiles cannot use my software" i can't really enforce that, but it still makes a (somewhat useless) statement. In my opinion, not allowing LLM code at least signals that codeberg (and forgejo) itself is unlikely to be majority LLM code, which raises…

> what kind of people the maintainers are. Can you elaborate on this? It's new that we're judging what kind of people we're dealing with based on what tools they use.

I really meant -- are these maintainers passionate about the design and maintenance of their tools, are they trying to slop up a demo fast enough that some VC buys them out, is this project a goal in itself or the means to some other end, etc...

Open source software that exists for its own sake is exceedingly rare, and understanding the goals of a community before becoming dependent on it is a good idea

Re: I regret migrating to Codeberg

#360

Post by infecto »

chmod775 wrote: post #250

Keeping up with this stuff is for people who define their identity through virtue signalling and whatever personality trait they have decided to make the problem of everyone around them. Let them have their little corner of the internet and just stay away. There's plenty of alternatives run by people who don't feel the need to bring their personal baggage into a cooperative environment.

I get tired of it because it just becomes a tit for tat war and you end up with these extremely polarized communities.

Codeberg is not for me, I could never get over them keeping the anubis anime girls on, but it would be nice if open source communities were a bit more open. There will always be a line to draw but some of the current rules feel arbitrary.

Post reply on HN