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Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

learnopengl.com

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Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#141

Post by pjmlp »

m-schuetz wrote: post #55
flakiness wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A data point: "OpenGL ES is still supported on Android, but is no longer under active feature development. Vulkan offers the following advantages over OpenGL ES" "Vulkan is the preferred Android interface to the GPU. Android 15 and up includes ANGLE as an optional layer for running OpenGL ES on top of Vulkan." https://developer.android.com/games/develop/vulkan/overview

Ironically, the Vulkan discord always complains about the bad support of Vulkan on mobile devices, and how OpenGL ES is still better supported.

Google has moved Android to having only Vulkan, with OpenGL ES on top via Angle, exactly to force OEMs to actually care about Vulkan support.

Until now it has been pretty much only usable on Google and Samsung phones.

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#142

Post by flohofwoe »

pjmlp wrote: post #138
flohofwoe wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> as it's not possible really to debug a WASM application ...as others have said, this is a solved problem and has been for quite a while: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=ms-vscod... I might even go that far and say that this solution is on average more robust and more responsive than debugging native code in Xcode.

> Last updated 27/09/2023 And only "works" for specific languages.

The extension is "feature complete" and works. Why should it need updates when it's not broken?

It should also work for all compiler toolchains that generate DWARF debug info, which is pretty much standard across all compiled languages, otherwise gdb or lldb couldn't be used either with those languages (Microsoft of course does its own thing, as is tradition, but its not like msvc supports wasm output in the first place - Blazor oth appears to support wasm debugging in VS and VSCode)

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#143

Post by jokoon »

I fear that in the future, opengl will be made obsolete and GPU vendors will stop supplying drivers for it, because it won't be worth it for them. Of course there are layers to be put on top of vulkan, but I don't know if they're reliable enough and can support 100% of opengl.

I would say that's one thing that the "stop killing games" movement would not see coming. I am not expert enough in graphics programming.

I am wary because lately, I realized I could not run blender 4.5 on a thinkpad from 2014, on windows, I had to use a 3.x version because that thinkpad has a chipset.

Generally in software, making things work for a long time doesn't generate profits, and it feels like opengl is getting a bit old already. I hope it won't happen and people can contradict me here.

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#144

Post by pjmlp »

flohofwoe wrote: post #142
pjmlp wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Last updated 27/09/2023 And only "works" for specific languages.

The extension is "feature complete" and works. Why should it need updates when it's not broken? It should also work for all compiler toolchains that generate DWARF debug info, which is pretty much standard across all compiled languages, otherwise gdb or lldb couldn't be used either with those languages (Microsoft of course does its own thing, as is tradition, but its not like msvc supports wasm output in the first pl…

Microsoft isn't the only platform doing its own thing, although this is irrelevant for this specific case.

Given how bad most of WebAssembly tooling still is to this day, versus native languages, I was kind of sceptic.

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#146

Post by jplusequalt »

gspr wrote: post #116
jplusequalt wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>could someone recommend a Vulkan introduction for people who don't "just want to make it work"? Khronos has a tutorial that walks you through getting a triangle on the screen, to rendering a glTF model, all the way up to how you go about making a simple engine. But I'm not sure what you mean by "understand". If you want to understand the graphics theory, Vulkan tutorials aren't going to teach you that.

> But I'm not sure what you mean by "understand". If you want to understand the graphics theory, Vulkan tutorials aren't going to teach you that. I meant understand the Vulkan-specific minutiae of setting everything up for either graphics or compute. There's an order of magnitude or two more of it than for OpenGL, and lots of tutorials seem to skip it and focus on the graphics. I'd like to understand what all that se…

>I'd like to understand what all that setup does and why it's done a particular way.

That's something you'll only understand after trying to build something non-trivial with an older graphics API like OpenGL.

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#147

Post by gspr »

jplusequalt wrote: post #146
gspr wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I'm not sure what you mean by "understand". If you want to understand the graphics theory, Vulkan tutorials aren't going to teach you that. I meant understand the Vulkan-specific minutiae of setting everything up for either graphics or compute. There's an order of magnitude or two more of it than for OpenGL, and lots of tutorials seem to skip it and focus on the graphics. I'd like to understand what all that se…

>I'd like to understand what all that setup does and why it's done a particular way. That's something you'll only understand after trying to build something non-trivial with an older graphics API like OpenGL.

Nonsense. Man-made things can be explained by humans without needing to experience what came before.

Re: Learn OpenGL, extensive tutorial resource for learning Modern OpenGL

#148

Post by jplusequalt »

gspr wrote: post #147
jplusequalt wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'd like to understand what all that setup does and why it's done a particular way. That's something you'll only understand after trying to build something non-trivial with an older graphics API like OpenGL.

Nonsense. Man-made things can be explained by humans without needing to experience what came before.

Sure, it can be. Doesn't mean you'll take much away from it unless you're deeply familiar with the old ways of doing things.
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