Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

politico.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

881–890 of 983 posts

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#881

Post by vkaku »

throw1234567891 wrote: post #605
vkaku wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, I'm on this one too. Nothing stays forever one way. You all find me on the other ones, add me there and give me a reason to post to a wider audience. I'm on LinkedIn too ... most people won't even engage the same way there and I just want a simple easy way to engage.

I read the thread. It sounds dangerous sending any donations to a Russian national based in Moscow in the current political climate. Maybe that’s why nobody on LinkedIn wants to chime in.

Well, glad you went over the whole thread, especially purveying what is happening out there.

The development cost for those not under capture is really as asymmetrically low as it gets.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#882

Post by orloffm »

cloakandswagger wrote: post #855
jiaosdjf wrote: post #841

Banning them would hand European startups a gift of low cost inference so I am 100% in support of this. The globalists had no problem selling out our manufacturing to China, now they are crying because China can provide a cheaper service. Anthropic and OpenAI have executed the greatest intellectual property heist in human history and they are angry because China stole from thieves and distillation isn't even technica…

The globalists had no problem selling out our manufacturing to China, now they are crying because China can provide a cheaper service. The globalists of old would happily hand AI dominance to China in exchange for a decade or two of short-term gains. The fact that protectionist measures are even being considered shows that the globalists who sold out manufacturing to China aren't at the wheel anymore.

They are. Selling out was done with the expectation that "the West" will outsource the basics, but will have hands freed to "reach singularity" and will keep the braids of all the technological chains. Now the "reaching singularity" itself is being lost, so everyone suddenly understands that there is nothing left.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#883

Post by PunchyHamster »

capevace wrote: post #350

I‘m not even sure what the argument for banning Chinese models/open weights even is supposed to be? 1. if it’s to stop hackers doing hacking things with „uncontrollable models“ then, well… they’re already doing something illegal to begin with, why would they care about breaking another law running these models? 2. if it’s to stop foreign actors, then that ban would not apply to them anyway 3. it’s not stopping distil…

> I don’t get it. Am I missing something? The only thing a ban would do is protect the American market from further downward price pressure on inference, protecting VC investors in the short term.

You say you don't get it then you say exactly why they are doing it. You get it just fine.

Actual arguments are only there to make govt do something. Intent is to stop competition. With Chinese models being let's say 6 months to year behind it's quickly shrinking profit margin that even if we hit the pie in the sky AI usage numbers the American companies want us to believe, they wouldn't be able to live off with that competition

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#884

Post by ngl999 »

HighGoldstein wrote: post #731
999900000999 wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's going to force American companies to only use inferior and more expensive models. It's protectionism which will only extend our dominance by at most a decade. The rest of the world will progress without us.

Decade? We're 4 years in since ChatGPT released publicly and have gone from "Wow this thing is stupid" to running coding agents on auto mode, and the Chinese labs have been around for even less time. The US providers may lose dominance in 1 or 2 years.

They won't. China doesn't have the training capacity and the quality data sets, the former because of access to fabs, the latter because of internal censorship that is getting worse by day.

Simple as that.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#886

Post by thesmtsolver2 »

one33seven wrote: post #801
thesmtsolver2 wrote: post #739

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because they're so much better cars than our domestic brands Is that objectively true? True after factoring in harms they do to human rights and the environment? Nope. https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2026/may/12/c... https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/10/human-rights-... Remember, even EU despite claiming to be morally superior to the US, heavily tariffs BYD (much more than the tariffs that…

Are you saying USA is somehow a good example for environmental issues and human rights? Read the news in the past years?

Did you read the links I attached?

Are you saying China is better in human rights?

Read the news in the past few years?

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#887

Post by gigatexal »

scoofy wrote: post #776
gigatexal wrote: post #751

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I'd much rather have Vance right now. I don't like the guy, but he's clearly got a good education and isn't literally selling crypto-as-bribe tokens openly.

You are not flummoxed by his willingness to sell everything he stands for to be close to power? The man is a psycho by every definition. He plus Stephen miller are the new Adolf and Goebels

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#888

Post by gigatexal »

chii wrote: post #779
gigatexal wrote: post #751

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Let’s hope the next one is better Trump has shown the world that you don't need to "be better" to get into the top job. I bet the more conniving machiavellians will pretend to be better, but secretly operate even worse than trump.

Like a Vance presidency

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#889

Post by decimalenough »

ngl999 wrote: post #884
HighGoldstein wrote: post #731

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decade? We're 4 years in since ChatGPT released publicly and have gone from "Wow this thing is stupid" to running coding agents on auto mode, and the Chinese labs have been around for even less time. The US providers may lose dominance in 1 or 2 years.

They won't. China doesn't have the training capacity and the quality data sets, the former because of access to fabs, the latter because of internal censorship that is getting worse by day. Simple as that.

The current panic is happening precisely because Chinese open weight models like Kimi and Qwen are demonstrably competitive with SotA models like Fable, but far cheaper.

https://fireworks.ai/blog/kimik3-fable

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#890

Post by ngl999 »

runako wrote: post #651
gpt5 wrote: post #636

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The argument is - these models costs hundreds of billions to develop - to BOTH US and China. China is giving them for free despite not making financial sense because they want to weaken US's tech firms ability to compete - because China sees AI dominance as critical for their national security. The US also sees AI dominance as critical for their national security, and relies on a market economy and non-state-owned la…

> China is giving them for free despite not making financial sense because they want to weaken US's tech firms ability to compete - because China sees AI dominance as critical for their national security. Nobody is making this argument because this is a normal thing that companies do. It's so common it is named in business strategy: "commoditize your complements." There's a 2002 Joel On Software post explaining this…

> Putting cheap AI in the world creates demand for cloud services

No, Alibaba doesn't have the right amount of hardware to serve these models.

The part that benefits Alibaba in these open models is to maintain its public reputation so as to maintain its stock price. The core that drives everything else inside Alibaba is its e-commerce.

Post reply on HN