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Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

politico.com

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Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#801

Post by one33seven »

thesmtsolver2 wrote: post #739
treyd wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But thats also an admittance that the American labs can’t compete on merit anymore This is exactly it. Try to buy a BYD in the United States. You can't (without a complicated process) because they're so much better cars than our domestic brands that our domestic brands couldn't compete and lobbied to keep them out. > should by itself also limit the viability of the idea that all those VC billions will ever make a r…

> because they're so much better cars than our domestic brands Is that objectively true? True after factoring in harms they do to human rights and the environment? Nope. https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2026/may/12/c... https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/10/human-rights-... Remember, even EU despite claiming to be morally superior to the US, heavily tariffs BYD (much more than the tariffs that…

Are you saying USA is somehow a good example for environmental issues and human rights? Read the news in the past years?

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#802

Post by OrangeMusic »

capevace wrote: post #350

I‘m not even sure what the argument for banning Chinese models/open weights even is supposed to be? 1. if it’s to stop hackers doing hacking things with „uncontrollable models“ then, well… they’re already doing something illegal to begin with, why would they care about breaking another law running these models? 2. if it’s to stop foreign actors, then that ban would not apply to them anyway 3. it’s not stopping distil…

I don't know if this fallacy has a name but there's something about "it's useless to make something illegal because the bad guys will ignore the law".

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#803

Post by tonyhart7 »

hananova wrote: post #787
tonyhart7 wrote: post #747

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You get downvoted for praising Grok because its elon company

How is saying that a model “causes terror” praise?

You fall for social media again, the model didn't cause terror if user prompt to do it in first place

or are you going to blame the knife if people use it to stab ??

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#804

Post by Buttons840 »

syradar wrote: post #674
claw-el wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you seen my latest model, called HLM, from y.ai, there is one single model weight that is different from the popular open source model, but I promise you it is no longer the same thing..

That wouldn’t hold up in court and you would be jailed. Your intent is still to provide the illegal model.

The actual way to do this is run a few fine-tuning passes on some pro-America nationalistic freedom loving anti-China propaganda, and then you can tell the judge with a straight face that it's a new model.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#806

Post by inigyou »

one33seven wrote: post #796
scoofy wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Both sides support genocide, under Biden even more Black people died in america. Both truly are the same (ignoring DSA and extreme MAGA, but the centrists of both are doing the same politics)

One candidate supports two genocides, the other supports seven.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#807

Post by hirako2000 »

munk-a wrote: post #401
stusmall wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't wrap my head around the idea that distillation is IP theft but mass training on books, music and art without consent is fair use. The two stances are incompatible. If it is transformative use of a book, it is transformative use of AI output.

I really hope that when a sane administration returns to power in the US we'll actually get a reckoning over how irrational it was to not restrict training data.

It isn't irrational.

The idea is that selling, or giving away art grants the consumer to sell art of his own, not a clear copy of.

So the court rationally found Anthropic guilty for acquiring copies without paying for them. But didn't charge the training, deemed fair use.

If it isn't fair use, then we may need to sue all teachers for spitting out knowledge they ultimately acquired from someone's work.

Copyright, some would say is irrational. Humans learn, that is copying, distilling in fact.

Copyright though is pragmatic: it draws a line, art will be reproduced, let's just enforce that they can't be shameless (near) identical copies. Mix it up, derive the original enough so that you aren't competing with the original author.

The only argument to ban training on copyright data is that it unfairly compete with original authors. Which stance do you take? Neither would be irrational.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#808

Post by Aerroon »

vkou wrote: post #698
mythrwy wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say "Both sides are the same". I said both candidates were morons. As far as terms, I don't like really like either side we have on the menu right now.

Biden may have been a senile fool in 2025, but he was smart enough to listen to people who knew their ass from their elbow. And to also not burn down the furniture to 'own' his political enemies.

He did do the "can't sell GPUs to Poland*" move when he was on his way out though.

Separating countries into "tier 1" and "tier 2" was a pretty bad look, especially when a bunch of European countries that seemed to have good relations with the US ended up in tier 2. Looked suspiciously similar to the iron curtain.

https://www.euractiv.com/news/biden-divides-eu-with-new-ai-c...

* It wasn't that they couldn't sell GPUs at all, but they put caps on the amount.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#809

Post by inigyou »

pessimizer wrote: post #592
scoofy wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> "Both sides are the same" is the last bastion of denial. This is hyperpartisan bullshit that you obviously wouldn't say if someone were choosing between a red shirt and a blue shirt. If you support some political candidate, defend them on the merits of their positions and capabilities, not by repeating content-free jingles. Or even worse, based on unexplored counterfactuals: "X" did this, don't you wish you picked…

Why do you think the red and blue shirt are identical except their color?

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#810

Post by inigyou »

999900000999 wrote: post #761
HighGoldstein wrote: post #731

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decade? We're 4 years in since ChatGPT released publicly and have gone from "Wow this thing is stupid" to running coding agents on auto mode, and the Chinese labs have been around for even less time. The US providers may lose dominance in 1 or 2 years.

I’m talking about our overall economic dominance. We’re still the most powerful economy on earth, but I can’t imagine this continuing forever.

By what metric - GDP? That measures price level, not economic power.
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