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Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

politico.com

241–250 of 983 posts

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#241
post #211
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The era of so-called "intellectual property" is over. You can accept it or not. But it's going to be a lot easier if you do.

So how come Disney still gets upset when I provide copies of their movies on my website as "training set for biological neural networks"? The problem isn't that IP is dying - in most industries it died ages ago. The problem is that it is now explicitly reserved for the rich.

The solution is straightforward -- be rich!

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#242
post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is proof the US propaganda is working This is a thought-terminating cliche. (The folks telling you to stop being sheeple are unusually consistently claimed independent thinkers.) > How much damage has China done recently militarily? Exempting the Iran war, which has no justification, as much as America. We’re both backing proxies. (Though we’ve had a while since we shot at or annexed our neighbours.)

It seems pretty silly to answer a question about military intervention by insisting that the major instance of military intervention by a world power that's happened in the last year shouldn't be counted

> by insisting that the major instance of military intervention by a world power that's happened in the last year shouldn't be counted

I’m not. I’m saying exempting that, we have an even field of conflict mongering. Counting Iran, the field is biased, but we have significant sampling-timing issues for something like “is there war.”

China has violently annexed sovereign countries in the past decades. Its threats to do the same again are at least as serious as Trump’s Greenland nonsense. There can be more than one baddie.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#243
post #128
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anthropic was asked to pay book authors because it trained on pirated downloaded books. What about books and art where the author/artist does not authorise AI to train on it? They do happily train on it, ignoring their "ToS". This is just double standards, a slap on the wrist to not worsen the situation with authors imo. You could also say the Chinese companies are doing the same - they _do_ pay for their Anthropic s…

Pirating millions of dollars worth of books would land people in jail. Government went after Aaron Scwartz for "pirating" scientific journals.

Aaron Schwartz was re-publishing the journals, which is the core concern or copyright and indeed where the word "copyright" comes from. Anthropic could get in a lot more trouble if their models are caught reproducing copyrighted work from their training set wholesale.

I think the Aaron Schwartz case is incredibly vexing because he was obviously acting out of a sense of altruism without personal self-interest. I don't think he deserved the book getting thrown at him like that. But the whole copyright system, which people seem to think is simultaneously good and bad, kinda rests on not allowing those kinds of violations

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#245
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might wanna reflect on who’s threatening hot war lately.

The main actors threatening (and delivering) a hot war are China, and by proxy, Russia. The Ukraine war is absolutely and transparently enabled by China, who is also trying to actively destabilize the EU and the US in order to make its conquest of Taiwan more likely. Yes, the US has an idiot in charge who is threatening these things in response, too. However, unlike China, the electorate does not support him. His ele…

Count wars, invasions and simply messing with other countries by the US starting since the end of WWII and then come back. Your post is a pile of BS

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#246
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As if scraping the entire internet doesn't break thousands of TOSes?

Yes, indeed! I have a site where 99% of the traffic is Claude. I could ban them but I don’t bother.

I poison their requests with crap, particularly because they were the worst offenders for sheer request rate. The site has maybe a hundred pages, and I'd see them hit at a sustained 20 rps for weeks on end, same content being pulled over and over and over again. Easily handled by my small server as it's static content, but the sheer arrogance (inadvertent or otherwise) pissed me off.

I'm not sure if they caught on, or just finally started behaving better, but after months of being served crap in my never ending labyrinth of auto-generated junk, they have stopped.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#247
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Please don't use uppercase for emphasis. Instead, put asterisks* around it and it will get italicized. More formatting info here.*

fixed.

I vouched, not sure it will help.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#248
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the major destabilizing force is the country that has been building the infrastructure for a hot war over Taiwan for the last decade while simultaneously blatantly funding the conquest of Ukraine. The US stupidly withdrawing from the world stage is definitely making this worse, of course, but it is not the catalyst. It's unfortunately a very likely side effect of a social media campaign by the same actor to m…

It's literally on their border and the history is akin to if The South established its own nation state in Cuba after the Civil War and China became its ally. At least admit the double standard. I don't mind realpolitik but it's so tedious when it's not plainly stated and there's this veneer of civility. Yes, the US is allowed to do whatever it wants to in South America. No, other nation states don't have a sphere of…

Taiwan has been self governing for longer than almost everyone that lives there has been alive. It's also a vibrant democracy.

If you care about democracy and human rights, it's morally reprehensible NOT to support Taiwan. We can debate the ethics of intervening in strongman dictatorships like Venezuela, Cuba, or Iran, but Taiwan is clear.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#249
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, illegally, got it

It has the tacit consent of Congress, so it's mostly only illegal in the way it's carried out. Congress could make most of it legal right now, but they don't want to put their names on it. Some of it would probably be unconstitutional for Congress to authorize (ironically via the nondelegation clause which is now being repurposed to justify a thoroughly unconstituational unitary executive arrangement), but much of it…

If you were to keep using a chinese model after said ban, you would need to be charged with a crime and be found guilty in a court of law for this to be true.

What it would do is have an instant chilling effect across Corporate America, which is the goal.

Re: Startup founders urge U.S. government not to shut off Chinese open weight AI

#250

The U.S. does NOT have copyright protections on the data that AI models were and are trained on, it was mass theft. Now all of a sudden, the Chinese are stealing from the thieves and we’re supposed to care? No one cares, we just want cheaper AI models that are equally as powerful. They’re all thieves regardless.

Training on copyright was ruled to be transformative. Anthropic was just fined for not paying for the pirated books they copied into a training database. Same as anyone else who copied pirated IP onto their hard drive. However, training an AI on copyright has been ruled to be sufficiently transformative and not a violation of IP laws. The same way you can make a gameplay clone of Call of Duty without any issue.

> Same as anyone else who copied pirated IP onto their hard drive

Not really the same. Private citizens have received fines MUCH higher per-work when downloading for just their private consumption.

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