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Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

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Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#151

Post by toast0 »

qurren wrote: post #129
toast0 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need on the order of 15 permanent onsite employees to run a datacenter; 5 each for 24/7 coverage of security, building maintenance, and tech. You probably don't really need 24/7 onsite for building maintenance or tech. Traveling employees or (probably traveling) contractors can handle projects that exceed the local scope. Should be able to locally source security and building maintenance, if the pay is good. Thes…

I don't consider 30 minutes away from town the "boonies", that's more like a normal commute. The boonies would be like a 3 hour drive in the Sonora desert.

Well, "boonies" is pretty ill defined, but my criteria is most homes are are 10+ acre lots, and large lots are widely available.

You want your datacenter to be in reach of interstate highways (rail might be nice, too), two electrical substations [1], and close to fiber that's already run. That restricts your available boonies, but there's still lots outside of the east coast.

[1] yes, you'll have onsite generation, and yes, you might plan to run from onsite generation most of the time, but you still want to have the option for utility power, and it's nice to have two substations to get more uptime, subject to more transfer switch complexity.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#152

Post by narcraft »

vitally3643 wrote: post #98
Aurornis wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I might believe that if the protests weren't being organized on Facebook and then posted to YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok. It's more like garbage dumps. People don't want to moderate their production of garbage, they just don't want any consequences of it to be too close to their house.

"I see you're complaining about society and yet you participate in society! Very interesting! I am very smart." This is not a good or reasoned take. People organize where the other people are because that's how you get the most people. It is nor hypocrisy to use Facebook as a platform to organize protests against other tech companies. Just as it is not hypocrisy to criticize the society you live within. This is a ver…

It is a good or reasoned take (but perhaps not both!). There is some sliver of hypocrisy in condemning tech companies wholesale while enjoying their products. But just because something is hypocritical, it doesn't invalidate all related criticisms. If you don't like the negative byproducts of a good or service, that's a perfectly valid gripe. But those byproducts are a necessary consequence of the status quo. In order to eliminate or mitigate the undesired consequences, some change would need to occur in the real world that would require a hitherto unforeseen innovation or it would otherwise increase the cost of providing the good or service, potentially so much so that prices would increase to undesirable levels, or it would become economically unviable to produce the good or service entirely. So without more specific criticism, and combined with polemic rhetoric, it's reasonable to assume that some are arguing that the world would be better off without AI datacenters and the models they support entirely. And if those same persons enjoy those same services, it's reasonable to sense some tension there. Maybe they haven't thought the whole thing through. I don't think it's a stupid observation.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#153

Post by Terr_ »

Aurornis wrote: post #68
datakan wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There were no plans to build data centers in their small town and no reason to consider it at all You have to be fair on this though. The time to ban something is before they start talking about doing it, not after. Being ahead of the game is never a bad thing, especially when small towns are so easily exploited due to income and infrastructure. They just can't afford long legal battles.

The interesting thing about the anecdote wasn't the timing. It was that there was no reason to build a data center there but they felt compelled to make it their top priority. > especially when small towns are so easily exploited due to income and infrastructure. Small, remote towns without electricity or data connections are not easily exploited for data centers.

I don't think anyone's talking about towns where electricity is absent or expensive.

Instead it's locations that begin with cheap electricity (attracting the datacenter) but the residents fear a significant increase in electricity costs with no local economic benefits to offset it.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#154

Post by AngryData »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #141
christina97 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the people in charge of site picking also shop for low regulation environments.

isn't that their freedom to? And the right/freedom of those who democratically created the low regulation environment? I do not understand this idea that someone from one place should have their preferences taking precedence the preferences, rights and freedoms of folks who actually live in another place. The main caveat being the boundary lines, but i think that's very much an edge case.

And it is the citizen's freedom to say they don't want it, the same as pig farms and oil refineries trying to build next door to them.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#155

Post by neutronicus »

dylan604 wrote: post #134
dv_dt wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does a data center need to be an immediate neighbor to raise electricity rates or consume water capacity?

This is such an obvious concern that it's hard to understand how the GP didn't think of it as well. Clearly, people don't always consider all the things and get focused in so they can't see the forest for the trees.

It also doesn't necessarily matter if the data centers actually raise electricity rates.

Regardless of whether or not they do, you can block their construction and try to horse-trade it for relief on energy prices.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#158

Post by 1970-01-01 »

adamrezich wrote: post #137
1970-01-01 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what agenda you're going with, but it isn't reality. They're destroying water tables. I'll leave this link here for you to read if you're brave enough to step outside your Captain Planet cartoon narrative and have an actual look at the water consumption problem. https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2025-ai-impacts-data-cent... Or if you prefer; a much deeper non-vibecoded, scientific source with lots of ci…

Why am I supposed to take a janky-ass web visualization, completely devoid of citations as far as I can tell, and which was, itself, almost certainly vibecoded, at face value, as a valid argument? I love how you went from posting links to articles to make arguments for you, to then editing your comment to link to a $250 book that I should buy and read, so it can make your argument for you.

Refusing to acknowledge sources is pathetic. The information directly refutes your cartoonish take on the problem if you're brave enough to pull yourself into reality.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#159

Post by quickthrowman »

grim_io wrote: post #100
quickthrowman wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that a problem? It might raise the temp within a few hundred feet of the chillers by 0.5-1F which is substantially less than an urban heat island temp delta vs surrounding rural land. A sane municipality will require sound mitigation on generators, chillers, and other loud equipment. Sure, there are shitty places that don’t take care of their citizens that will let you run natural gas turbines to generate powe…

It's not about the heat radiating from the data center, it's about the noise generated trying to cool the beast. The power usage is massive, and that's still a very much limited resource for which everyone competes for. Adding to your edit: Would you feel the same about adding an AI data center on top of the iron casting foundry you already have to deal with?

You can buy chillers with enclosures that limit the sound to a reasonable volume, Google “chiller noise attenuation”. You can add walls around lots of chillers to further limit the noise.

If the data center follows the city statutes for noise levels at the property line that exist in my municipality, then sure, I’ll take the data center above the iron foundry.

> Power usage is massive

The utility can approve or deny the connection. Data centers in areas without any available power are not getting grid connections.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#160

Post by win311fwg »

toast0 wrote: post #144
win311fwg wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While most people wouldn't hesitate to travel 30 minutes out of town, the generally don't ever think to see if jobs exist 30 minutes out of town, and thus won't find the work there. When looking for work they search within the city they live in, not the next town over with a name they might not even know. This is a real problem for a lot of businesses that exist 30 minutes out of town. In fairness, the companies behi…

> so they can likely find a way to close that gap I mean, typically you just list your job in the nearby major city, even when the site address isn't there. Same thing that you do when listing your hotel or your car for sale.

30 minutes out of town isn't nearby anymore. The highways are surprisingly efficient. And consider that it is more like a 1-1.5 hour drive for someone living on the opposing end of the city — possibly more if it is a large city. Advertising a job 1.5 hours away as if it is local doesn't tend to win you any admiration from job seekers. Maybe AI companies are prominent enough that they can piss off workers and still hire them in the end, but that doesn't fly for most businesses.

But, again, why take the risk when you can just as easily put the work right beside the workers?

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