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Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

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191–200 of 401 posts

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#191

Post by romanhounds »

pstuart wrote: post #175
inigyou wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On this particular issue both sides are identical. On other issues they are not.

On corporate whoredom? Absolutely. My pushback is that now is not the time for both-sides-ism. It needs to be addressed but most voters are poorly informed or vote their emotions and that talking point needs to go in the back pocket for later, if there is one. I get your point, and the other one stating that Democrats are not "the left", but they are the the least worst option that a 2 party system offers. The game i…

will you give up identity politics for the deplorables vote?

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#192

Post by LoganDark »

jonahx wrote: post #189
thatfrenchguy wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cardiac events from Apple Watches is not “AI” though

It unequivocally is AI. It's just not LLM-powered. The rising LLM = AI equivalency is unfortunate.

It's machine learning, which has overlap with AI but is not completely equivalent.

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#193

Post by tclancy »

derekdahmer wrote: post #115

I RFTA and the majority of the complaints are about call center metrics and the pressure to ration care. These are real concerns about misuse of metrics, but not AI. The AI empathy thing was a 2024 pilot that was discontinued. FWIW my wife works for Kaiser and finds a lot of value in the the medical LLM tools available to her. She tells me being able to do live translation, summarize notes, and quickly get comprehens…

Just for clarification, is your wife a doctor or a nurse?

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#194

Post by defrost »

romanhounds wrote: post #191
pstuart wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On corporate whoredom? Absolutely. My pushback is that now is not the time for both-sides-ism. It needs to be addressed but most voters are poorly informed or vote their emotions and that talking point needs to go in the back pocket for later, if there is one. I get your point, and the other one stating that Democrats are not "the left", but they are the the least worst option that a 2 party system offers. The game i…

will you give up identity politics for the deplorables vote?

Non-US PoV - US identity politics as an actual threat to panic and pearl clutch about seems to be largely a creation of the US right.

Actual US identity expression "issues" (visible drag queens, actually trans people, sports questions) seem to be small number small beer problems that should fall under US principles of "We let Nazi's march, so why not Furries" ?

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#195

Post by LoganDark »

ch4s3 wrote: post #185
thatfrenchguy wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cardiac events from Apple Watches is not “AI” though

It’s machine learning, which people routinely called AI not so long ago.

I never heard people calling machine learning "AI" until large language models made it trivial to market it as such. Like, I remember back when Netflix, for instance, was going around advertising how machine learning (not AI) powers their recommendations.

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#196

Post by fn-mote »

derekdahmer wrote: post #115

I RFTA and the majority of the complaints are about call center metrics and the pressure to ration care. These are real concerns about misuse of metrics, but not AI. The AI empathy thing was a 2024 pilot that was discontinued. FWIW my wife works for Kaiser and finds a lot of value in the the medical LLM tools available to her. She tells me being able to do live translation, summarize notes, and quickly get comprehens…

> AI-powered alerts from their apple watches that detected cardiac events

Surely these are “good old-fashioned AI” (statistical learning) and not LLM, though.

I just want to be clear that the “medical LLM” tools are the new ones, and the Apple Watch alerts aren’t.

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#197

Post by fn-mote »

LoganDark wrote: post #195
ch4s3 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s machine learning, which people routinely called AI not so long ago.

I never heard people calling machine learning "AI" until large language models made it trivial to market it as such. Like, I remember back when Netflix, for instance, was going around advertising how machine learning (not AI) powers their recommendations.

Ed: I disagree. My recollection is that machine learning was routinely sold as “AI” even when it obviously wasn’t. (IBM’s Watson was good at Jeopardy but not real medical applications.)

This isn’t exactly the same, but nothing in the book Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence would be considered AI today.

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#198

Post by bitwize »

fn-mote wrote: post #196
derekdahmer wrote: post #115

I RFTA and the majority of the complaints are about call center metrics and the pressure to ration care. These are real concerns about misuse of metrics, but not AI. The AI empathy thing was a 2024 pilot that was discontinued. FWIW my wife works for Kaiser and finds a lot of value in the the medical LLM tools available to her. She tells me being able to do live translation, summarize notes, and quickly get comprehens…

> AI-powered alerts from their apple watches that detected cardiac events Surely these are “good old-fashioned AI” (statistical learning) and not LLM, though. I just want to be clear that the “medical LLM” tools are the new ones, and the Apple Watch alerts aren’t.

LLMs are statistical learning. GOFAI is symbolic, rules-based stuff, expert systems and that.

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#199

Post by pstuart »

romanhounds wrote: post #191
pstuart wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On corporate whoredom? Absolutely. My pushback is that now is not the time for both-sides-ism. It needs to be addressed but most voters are poorly informed or vote their emotions and that talking point needs to go in the back pocket for later, if there is one. I get your point, and the other one stating that Democrats are not "the left", but they are the the least worst option that a 2 party system offers. The game i…

will you give up identity politics for the deplorables vote?

> will you give up identity politics for the deplorables vote?

That phrase gets used a lot, I'm curious what you mean by that.

If you mean "woke", then you're probably missing the irony of how that is actually used politically. Based on the phrasing of your question, I'm guessing you might have an irony deficiency. But please go on.

Political discussion here is frowned upon because it usually devolves into partisan name calling -- which justifies it not being tolerated.

But if you want to discuss policy or "hacking society", please do. I am of no political party and am more than happy to acknowledge the foibles of those I might associate with, as well as any of my own because everybody makes mistakes, no?

Re: Kaiser nurses say AI, surveillance are making their jobs and patient care worse

#200

Post by fn-mote »

ai_fry_ur_brain wrote: post #153
derekdahmer wrote: post #115

I RFTA and the majority of the complaints are about call center metrics and the pressure to ration care. These are real concerns about misuse of metrics, but not AI. The AI empathy thing was a 2024 pilot that was discontinued. FWIW my wife works for Kaiser and finds a lot of value in the the medical LLM tools available to her. She tells me being able to do live translation, summarize notes, and quickly get comprehens…

I personally will not use a provider who uses llm tools. I know it makes me and my coworkers less careful and lazier. Qualities I dont want in a health care providor. Ive actually moved primary care physicians over this once already, found the oldest guy I could who barely knows how to use a laptop but spends a bunch of extra time with me.

When LLMs stop helping me with my work, I’ll stop going to doctors who use them.

Too bad for me, it’s a real mixed bag. I need a doctor who is an AI-using LLM skeptic, I guess.

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