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EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

patrick-breyer.de

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Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#551

Post by blackqueeriroh »

belval wrote: post #265
Ruphin wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would big tech be in favor of having to scan message content? It puts more regulatory requirements in place on their activities. Would they not be in favor of _less_ regulation so they can provide services to their users with fewer legal considerations? If big tech _wanted_ to they could already backdoor their encryption and scan the message content, they don't need regulation to do that. The only thing that chan…

> Would they not be in favor of _less_ regulation so they can provide services to their users with fewer legal considerations? Regulatory capture. If the handling of user messages requires constant scanning and there are enough rules that you need a team of lawyers, then only Google, Meta and Apple will be able to afford it.

Apple is wholly against Chat Control.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#552

Post by stingraycharles »

spikels wrote: post #347
teekert wrote: post #38

This is a nice piece of democracy right here: "a measure it had rejected twice in March. Although a majority of voting Members of the European Parliament (MEPs) actually opposed the regulation (314 against, 276 in favor, 17 abstentions), the motion to reject it failed to secure the required absolute majority of 361 votes. As a result, mass scanning is now permitted again until 2028." "Oh no we can't get a majority to…

Not only was Chat Control 1.0 already rejected twice by the European Parliament but: - This vote took place on last day of the session when many MEPs had already left for Summer vacation - 112 MEPs of 719 didn't vote. - The vote was called only two days before as an "Rule 170 - Urgent procedure" - 73 MEPs missed the vote making it "urgent". Normally it takes months of procedure to come up for a final vote.

And then people wonder why there’s so little faith in the EU and why there is a perception of them being disconnected from the real interests of the people.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#553

Post by znort_ »

mvdtnz wrote: post #468
mflaherty22 wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very reductionist comment- if you're an elected representative and you leave early to take a vacation knowing you'll be missing votes, you're not doing your job..

Ever worked with Europeans? This is how they treat work. In their culture taking vacation and actually switching off is part of the job. I'm not making a value judgement but their approach to work is very different to what some of us are used to.

taking vacation and switching off is actually the sane thing for a person to do. the problem is that there is no provision for your post being covered while on vacation, and it's a problem in the enterprise/organization.

imo that a representative of the people misses a vote should just not be acceptable under any circumstances.

that's of course if we had to take "democracy" as an actually meaningful representation of the people. this was a cheap political maneuver to get a bill passed. happens everywhere. they would have gotten the bill through by any other means anyway.

that would be in an ideal democracy, though, in reality european parlamentarians don't even draft laws, they are only able to sign off on laws drafted by shady appointees of an equally shady and largely unelected (by the people) comission, take it or leave it. that, photo ops and declarations is their whole job, it shouldn't be too complicated to have a fucking substitute when on vacation.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#554

Post by guelo »

gorwell wrote: post #547
selfmodruntime wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any time now even the most pro-european EU defender will realise that what was once a trade union has slowly transformed itself into an undemocratic, bureaucratic monster.

Reddit still thinks the EU represents democracy.

Reddit is one of the few remaining platforms where reach is determined democratically. You demean that populous by calling it the singular "reddit", as if it's a single hive mind. But you'll probably get your way, I imagine the billionaire censorship campaign will come for it too eventually. Then you'll only ever get to hear thoughts you agree with, glorious day ey?

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#555

Post by tedggh »

mflaherty22 wrote: post #372
rowanG077 wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Politicians can take vacations. Many things went wrong here but this ain't it.

Very reductionist comment- if you're an elected representative and you leave early to take a vacation knowing you'll be missing votes, you're not doing your job..

Perhaps there should not be a vote while so many representatives are absent, unless it’s about a truly critical issue, like war.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#556

Post by montag »

Ruphin wrote: post #261
budududuroiu wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Internet Watch Foundation, the group, funded almost entirely by big tech, who pushed for this vote to be held under emergency procedure, is already at work lobbying for the end of E2EE [1]. In a couple years time, Chat Control 2.0 will come about, and the same tyrants will use the EU admission [2] that there is no evidence that suspicionless scanning of private communications has led to an increase in criminal co…

Why would big tech be in favor of having to scan message content? It puts more regulatory requirements in place on their activities. Would they not be in favor of _less_ regulation so they can provide services to their users with fewer legal considerations? If big tech _wanted_ to they could already backdoor their encryption and scan the message content, they don't need regulation to do that. The only thing that chan…

I think this is basically correct and aligns with Facebook’s massive push toward e2ee in Messenger. They don’t want to be on the hook, and didn’t do e2ee just for the fun of it

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#557

Post by sndgndgndgndy »

mattstir wrote: post #487
sndgndgndgndy wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, I guess governments of the whole western world just woke up one morning and decided to clamp down on the free exchange of information on the internet at the precise moment their citizenry was up in arms over Israel committing mass genocide and blackmailing their politicians. What a coincidence!

Although it would be much more exciting to have some world conspiracy, try to consider what that would mean. That conspiracy's so powerful it can singularly decide votes across a union of dozens of countries, and yet still feels the need to enact a law to invoke that power in the first place. No, this is a much more benign form of government overreach, one born out of a normal desire to suppress citizens, and perhaps…

You don't think Jeffrey Epstein blackmailing US and UK celebrities and politicians on behalf of the Israeli government qualifies as a conspiracy? Or that Epstein was one of many similar influence assets operated by Israel? Hell, AIPAC even brags publicly about buying elections here in the US.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#558

Post by Squarex »

Fizz43 wrote: post #548
petcat wrote: post #4

I don't want to hear about the EU's "strong digital privacy" laws and protections ever again.

Do you think people should have privacy from the government? That exists in a completely different realm than privacy against a private company.

Secrecy of correspondence is a pretty old concept.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#559

Post by ajsnigrutin »

ibejoeb wrote: post #273
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then you got the patriot act.

That was terrible. But then the NSA just started surveilling everything illegally anyway, laws be damned.

I was just pointing out that the 4th amendment is not really helping the americans with tyranny and all the related stuff :)

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#560

Post by rayiner »

blackqueeriroh wrote: post #546
rayiner wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The revised law not passing until it gets a majority would seem more democratic.

So is it undemocratic if a law is voted on by a majority and doesn’t pass because the law says it takes 3/4 to make that type of change?

It’s less democratic, yes.
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