Relevant Peter Girnus post, satire, sort of
https://x.com/gothburz/status/2074902503599059357
I just know insurance companies are going to use this to try to weasel out of doing their job
Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
951–960 of 1001 posts
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#952Cars are becoming shittier in Europe, dumb regulations and people building cars are clearly NOT driving them. My wife got a new Volvo recently: 1. You can only open it with your phone (find it in purse, unlock it, find the app, wait, click) or a card that can only open on the driver side (can’t open the trunk). What was fucking wrong with keys? 2. No behind the steering wheel screen, only a large tablet center of the…
It is fascinating that you look at design choices that Chinese Volvo copied from American Tesla (except for the speed limit) and declare that European cars are the problem.
Volvo is a Swedish company.
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#953Earlier quoted context omitted.
Over Christmas, I spent several minutes trying to debug my beeping dashboard - it only seemed to happen sometimes while driving, so stopping didn’t let me figure it out. Eventually I discovered that it was beeping at me because my eyes weren’t on the road enough. Of course, figuring that out required me to take my eyes off the road to figure out which blinking signal was associated with this particular alarm. Also, b…
Do you know if the law prevents you from modifying the car to disable these devices? Caveat to anyone considering this: Modifying could be used against you in a liability case. Additionally if your insurance contract has some stipulation about not removing these safety "features" and they find out, I would think you could be dropped.
All cars in the EU has to pass periodic inspections. All safety equipment must be in working order to pass.
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#954There's considerable cynicism in these comments and I have to suspect a puritan bent in most of them. No, no one is watching you. No, these cameras are not here to catch you doing bad things. The purpose is very clear: reduce roadway mortality by reducing distracted driving. Frankly, I want OTHER PEOPLE to have this system in their car, while they are driving around me. Half of the cars I've driven over the past 3 or…
> I'd hope lawmakers and public advocates can devise solutions that allow both safe cars and secure data practices. This is not a case where safety in one domain needs to be traded for safety in another. The reason for the cynicism is that this has never happened. Can you think of a time in tech when a new method that could be used for tracking and spying was devised and then everyone was sensible about it, developed…
> “ Can you think of a time in tech when a new method…”
1. Apple/Google exposure notifications during the latest pandemic. 2. The Signal Protocol. 3. Differential Privacy (DWork et al) deployed by the US Census and Apple/Google. 4. Examine David Chaum’s body of work. 5. PIR motion sensors. 6. Elder care monitors. 7. Cities selecting lidar over cameras in traffic applications (motivated by privacy). 8. Retail foot-traffic counters. 9. Stickfigure/silhouette masking in Japanese elder care recordings. 10. Those traffic signs that read, “your speed is X.” 11. On-air or active-session indicators in recording studios.
Jeez it turns out that when you go looking for examples of designed-for-privacy monitors they are EVERYWHERE. Sounds to me like it is a completely reasonable expectation.
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#955We were just in Sicily for vacation and got a new BYD for rent. At first I was excited, coming from US I never tried a Chinese car and wanted to check it out. Excitement was quickly replaced with annoyance, that thing would beep for every damn reason. "keep eyes on road", "you are tired, consider taking a break", etc. Then all the damn safety features that a couple of times almost caused me to slam into another car.…
Especially since if you were driving in Sicily you must have your head on a swivel 100% of the time. There are probably multiple fiat pandas trying to drag race around you on the one lane road that somehow has traffic going both ways, lol.
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#956Earlier quoted context omitted.
My in-laws Kia did this for me. It got really shitty when it got darker and presumably had to use an IR camera. And I am tall so the angle might have been bad. It flagged me every minute. Even when I intentionally focused right ahead. Tracking gaze is not immune to assorted failure modes.
There we maybe need some regulation that the system should be working, and the manufacturers of the cars should be forced to recall and fix the system if it doesn’t work! The solution to bad implementation can’t be to just throw our hands in the air and say that Kia produces bad cars so therefore we cannot introduce safety regulation
So, the fix to one bad regulation is another one?
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#957Earlier quoted context omitted.
I had a similar situation with a rental car, driving on winding roads. The beeping happened periodically as I was driving around hairpin bends, and the eye detection was triggered by me turning my head to look towards the oncoming sharp corner. Not the best situation to have a "safety" alert start chastising you!
I wonder if it’s malicious compliance on the part of the manufacturers. They can trivially determine if their tech is effective. Making it mandatory, despite the problems they must surely know about, might produce some democratic pressure for more nuanced legislation.
more likely that this is a harder problem than regulators assume.
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#958Earlier quoted context omitted.
> on a curve O yea, that is driver lane assist ... A Toyota rental had the same issue. In a specific steep exit corner (that goes up facing the sun), how many ** times the lane assist tries to force the car to go straight (as in, off the hill! ). The first few times when it happens, scares the ** out of me. Another fun one is going down a hill in a Rental Opel, roundabout with some cars, no problem. Slowing down natu…
> If your a safe driver That's the issue. So many people are burried in their phone or just simply driving irresponsibly for the conditions, these features may be better for them. As someone who respects the responsibility of driving a vehicle, they're definitely making things less safe in some situations.
I have a hard time imaging how those people can drive with the eye tracking features. Beep beep beep beep ...
Do people like zone it out like parents with kids are able to zone out their little screaming devils? lol
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#959I hate this.. I have to turn off the beeping feature of my car EVERY time i turn it on. It will beep if I drive above the speed limit, only it won’t always read the signs right..
I also recently discovered that I must periodically accept the terms when turning on my car, or else carplay won’t work. This isn’t every time but I think it’s on a timer as it’s at least every new day I’m driving it.
What the hell is this, who is expected to reread the terms every time they start the damn car
Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera
#960Earlier quoted context omitted.
My car (from VW Group) came with Active Lane Keep. It detects when you're drifting out of your lane and steers you back into it. Sounds great in theory. Except that in the US, if you're cruising in the right lane then every time there's an exit it will actively steer you towards the concrete median between the lane and the exit. I don't understand how this feature was signed off on. The risks outweigh the benefits, i…
I will never buy a car with that feature unless I can turn it off. I don't need the be fighting my car if I need to swerve in an emergency situation.
In my car, Renault Megane e-Tech, there's even a physical button to toggle that feature.
Though I've rarely had it misbehave so I keep it on. If I lived somewhere with lots of narrow winding roads however, I'd probably reach for that button.