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Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

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Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#11

Post by operation_moose »

larose wrote: post #10

I've been tracking this as well [1], and there's indeed a clear difference between pre-2023 and 2023 onward. [1] https://hnjobs.mathieularose.com

Unsurprisingly, the "Who's Hiring" almost perfectly tracks the "Software Development Job Postings on Indeed in the United States" data from the fed, though it doesn't go as far back.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IHLIDXUSTPSOFTDEVE

Most other industries follow a similar trend, but didn't fly quite as high in 2022 and aren't in as bad of a trough right now.

Electrical Engineering: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IHLIDXDETPELECENGI (actually up slightly)

Accounting: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IHLIDXUSTPACCO (more seasonal noise)

Marketing: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IHLIDXUSTPMARK

Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#13

Post by znamd »

gib444 wrote: post #6

I'm tired of reading job adverts for 3 people's jobs (frontend, backend, DevOps) all in one, all lead/staff/senior but not the salary to match any of that, not even close

you left out ai/ml stuff like agent/rags. the sad part is i'm willing to accept doing all this for a low salary but i just get rejected.

Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#17

Post by not_foobar »

znamd wrote: post #13
gib444 wrote: post #6

I'm tired of reading job adverts for 3 people's jobs (frontend, backend, DevOps) all in one, all lead/staff/senior but not the salary to match any of that, not even close

you left out ai/ml stuff like agent/rags. the sad part is i'm willing to accept doing all this for a low salary but i just get rejected.

same

Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#18

Post by einszwei »

smw wrote: post #14
brazukadev wrote: post #4

Most of the money that used to go to software is going straight to Google and Meta. The well has run dry.

Why would it go to Meta?

I assume advertising. But I'd claim that the money is actually going to anthropic and to a lesser extent openai

Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#19

Post by Towaway69 »

I'm kind of surprised that this is even moving the needle.

Really, what do you expect from a "profession" that has been trying to lower the entry level to a point where anyone with access to an AI is a programmer?

I remember when folks had to have a degree to enter the "profession" of software developer. Nowadays all you need to be a "programmer" is access to AI. And correspondingly the quality of the output has fallen to such a level that it no longer possible to distinguish between human generated or machine generated code.

The bad quality is hidden away with euphemisms such as "release early, release often" or "move fast and break things". The constant requirement to update because updates were broken is just another symptom of an industry gone badly wrong.

Worse still, the solution coming out the tech hubs isn't to slow down and reflect about these issues in IT, rather it's to throw even more technology at it. Technology that then also fails. Technology that is designed to cause vendor-lockin and dependence on a few controlling companies (OpenAI & Anthropic being the latest in a long line ... AWS for servers and Google for spreadsheets and email).

Hm ... now what do we do? More of the same probably.

Re: Tell HN: Who wants to be hired" posts outpace "Who's hiring" 2 to 1

#20

Post by marssaxman »

Towaway69 wrote: post #19

I'm kind of surprised that this is even moving the needle. Really, what do you expect from a "profession" that has been trying to lower the entry level to a point where anyone with access to an AI is a programmer? I remember when folks had to have a degree to enter the "profession" of software developer. Nowadays all you need to be a "programmer" is access to AI. And correspondingly the quality of the output has fall…

> I remember when folks had to have a degree to enter the "profession" of software developer.

I am not old enough to remember that era; by the 1980s, when I was learning to code, it was already quite normal to get a programming job on the basis of skill you had acquired independently. The past era of quality code you refer to must already have ended, because most of the code I encountered back then would be considered garbage now.

I spent many years of my early career trying to lower the entry level to a point where anyone who could read and write English could be a programmer: this was a popular idea, part of the whole "democratization of computing" theme that came along with the development of the personal computer. BASIC was popular, GUI interface builders were popular, HyperCard was popular, there were many efforts to make software construction as easy as anything else you might do with a computer. This all continued into the web era.

In the end, though, it seems that the great majority of people don't want to make their own software.

> More of the same probably.

Yes, I imagine so. Technology keeps changing, but history goes around in circles!

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