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Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

reuters.com

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Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#161

Post by JumpCrisscross »

amanaplanacanal wrote: post #108
SanjayMehta wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UN is stuck in 1945. The UNSC needs to throw out the UK, France, and bring in Brazil, India, South Africa and Germany. And this veto nonsense needs to go away.

The security council was built around the nuclear powers at the time. I guess there are two ways to look at it: 1: The new nuclear powers should be included, I guess including N Korea, India, and Pakistan. And possibly Israel, if they admit to having them. 2: Rethink the whole thing. Are nukes really as important as everybody thought they were after WWII? If not, what should we look at to decide who to include?

> Are nukes really as important as everybody thought they were after WWII?

Possibly moreso. Nuclear sovereignty is demonstrably above the conventional type. At the end of the day, having a forum where nuclear powers with long-range delivery capability can veto things reduces the risk of them using that capability to veto in the real world.

By the range requirement, Tel Aviv and Pyongyang qualify for UNSC inclusion. New Delhi and Islamabad do not—they will mostly just nuke each other.

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#162

Post by lovich »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #30
cognitiveinline wrote: post #3

Maybe to spark curious conversation, when a world power seems to be supportive of actions that an international body considers negative, what structure can help resolve these? It does seem like UN is unable to really make a dent here.

The UN is stuck in 1945. The UNSC needs to throw out the UK, France, and bring in Brazil, India, South Africa and Germany. And this veto nonsense needs to go away.

I sort of see your logic other than South Africa. Why would you drop two nuclear powers who have some means of force projection for a middling economy and military?

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#163

Post by JumpCrisscross »

isgb wrote: post #48
utirrjrk wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many countries have strict laws how to deal with genocide, genocide support, and genocide deniers! So just enforce local laws, report supporters of genocide to police.

Pro-tip (observe what the UK does closely): Don't call it a genocide and then you don't need to do anything about it.

> Don't call it a genocide and then you don't need to do anything about it

Personally speaking, the is-it-a-genocide debate makes me tune out. It’s hyperlegal, clearly a moving target and selectively prosecuted by each side to the point of, often, absurdity.

If two people want to debate it, fine, but I have no obligation to pay attention. If we want to talk about harms and harm reduction, that feels more concrete and relatable.

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#164

Post by _menelaus »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #159

There's only one honorable response, and it couldn't be simpler: A complete and immediate arms and dual-use technology embargo of Israel, combined with more general sanctions. South Africa should be the model: Just ostracize them as much as possible. Say what you will about Russia, but Israel can never be self-sufficient, and China (justifiably) appears to despise them, so sanctions and embargoes would be substantial…

I think the why has more to do with capture of our media and politicians through collusion, bribery and blackmail. Epstein, etc.

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#165

Post by JumpCrisscross »

amanaplanacanal wrote: post #110
thrance wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you should still care. They have nukes and have promised to use them were Tel Aviv to fall.

I suspect that without American support, they would have to do quite a bit to change their behavior. They probably can't afford the current level of conflict on their own. It would force them to negotiate with their neighbors.

Or double down with India or China. (Or a right-wing Europe.)

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#166

Post by lovich »

Computer0 wrote: post #158
gershy wrote: post #153

I was trying to pay attention to the actual claim and I got: 1. Children died during the ceasefire 2. Israel is using larger bomb payloads than it should (according to who?) in civilian areas 3. Higher percentage of child deaths than in earlier conflicts Still, for me, doesn't add up to "Israel deliberately targetted gaza children" - is the claim that this is systemic? Or rampant? Or just by some individuals? And how…

It's pretty clear Israel systematically kills Palestinian children to those paying attention. According to a public statement by the United Nations, Gaza has the highest number of child amputees per capita in the world. At least 21,289 children have been killed. They starve the population, drive them out of their homes. ( https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... ) This is the modus operandi of…

I gotta be honest, the phrase “colonial settler ideology” gets an instant eye roll and detracts from the rest of your statements. Most nations on the planet are formed of settlers unless you think there were always Russians in Siberia, or there were always Anglo-Saxons on Albion.

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#167

Post by JumpCrisscross »

amanaplanacanal wrote: post #113
n4r9 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not expelling Ukrainians to resettle the place with "ethnic Russians" The similarity might be stronger than you suspect. Russia abducts and transports Ukrainian children to controlled territories [0], and actively encourages its own citizens to relocate to captured Ukrainian areas through economic incentives, subsidized housing, and aggressive long-term repopulation strategies. [0] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articl…

Kidnapping and moving children to new parents also counts as genocide under the convention on genocide.

Ukraine is my pet war. I really hope we don’t get caught in the genocide-debate tar pit as well.

What’s happening is evil. That’s relatable, both in the problem and potential solutions. Whether it’s genocide under some international convention strikes me as a counterproductive distraction that replaces something horrifying with something boring.

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#168

Post by Manuel_D »

Qem wrote: post #152
nubinetwork wrote: post #144

[flagged]

Lots of tech companies involved in this genocide[1]. Unfortunately tech has bad antecedents, as IBM also supported genocide in WWII[2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_companies_involved_in_... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and_the_Holocaust

Many of the companies in that list have essentially zero link to the events in Gaza. E.g. a Swiss company that supplies coal to Israel is considered complicit in genocide. Because Israelis having electricity means complicity in genocide, apparently. Hyundai is included because it sells vehicles to Israel, allegedly those machines were used to destroy Palestinian building but the cited source doesn't mention Hyundai: https://www.ohchr.org/en/documents/country-reports/ahrc5923-...

Might as well have titled the page "companies that do business with Israel".

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#169

Post by overfeed »

thrance wrote: post #84
jalapenoj wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully Israel will have lost American support in a generation or so, who cares what happens to them after that.

Well, you should still care. They have nukes and have promised to use them were Tel Aviv to fall.

Iran[1] may also have all the pieces for nukes by then[2], hence Bibi's fraught gamble with the decapitation strikes, and present desperation to continue - even escalate - hostilities.

1. Or the UAE, which has shown interest in nuclear tech, perhaps for strictly peaceful purposes

2. I.e. attain nuclear latency, and finally make real what Netanyahu has been warning the world for decades: that Iran is "weeks away from a nuclear bomb"

Re: Israel targeted Gaza children resulting in genocide, UN inquiry says

#170

Post by runarberg »

spwa4 wrote: post #83
HeavyStorm wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the latest Gaza war taught us anything, is that UN is powerless. And, unfortunately, it is the highest entity that could apply leverage here, so... Not much we can do. In the long term I hope other nations realize they are very vulnerable and begin to invest more in defense, but that escalation can have other downsides.

[flagged]

This post is genocide apologia disguised as a question of curiosity. It does not belong in a tech forum.
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