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Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

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Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#41

Post by vrganj »

FergusArgyll wrote: post #36
vrganj wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Are you implying I'm a Nazi for thinking that there's a cultural component to Marxist thought some of which is present in modern culture?! If I misunderstood your comment, I apologize

I'm not implying you're a Nazi, but I am pointing out the historical heritage of this line of argument.

We've been here before, this exact same conspiracy theory was created by the Nazis to justify the unjustifiable.

The slight rebranding of "Cultural B̶o̶l̶s̶h̶e̶v̶i̶s̶m̶ Marxism" is what Anders Breivik used to justify his acts of terrorism.

We've gone done this road before. It doesn't lead anywhere good.

I'm not putting ill intent on you, but I would implore you to reconsider your stance on this.

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#42

Post by draw_down »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

So to summarize: he resuggested "WikiProject Intellectual Diversity", a group with the goal to make "Wikipedia more intellectually diverse" and "ensure fair and open decision-making and governance, broaden the range of permissible sources, reinforce genuine neutrality, rein in over-aggressive blocking while holding the powerful to higher standards of accountability", etc, with the implied undertone of preventing Wiki…

[dead]

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#43

Post by blanched »

Enginerrrd wrote: post #40
croes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There is a large movement to censor this guy's opinions Wikipedia is the wrong place for opinions

Having opinions on Wikipedia policies is perfectly appropriate.

Sure, and he's probably not being censored on those.

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#44

Post by Sweepi »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

So to summarize: he resuggested "WikiProject Intellectual Diversity", a group with the goal to make "Wikipedia more intellectually diverse" and "ensure fair and open decision-making and governance, broaden the range of permissible sources, reinforce genuine neutrality, rein in over-aggressive blocking while holding the powerful to higher standards of accountability", etc, with the implied undertone of preventing Wiki…

Well there is a lot more, e.g.:

After that, Larry Sanger remarked: "What people don't realize, actually, is the number of people who are actually at work on Wikipedia on any given day is not really that enormous. It's more in the hundreds or low thousands, not in the millions. Well, there's a lot of people in India. There's a lot of educated people in India, right? There's a lot more educated people in India than there are in, say, England. Just due to sheer numbers, you can field a lot of good writers on Wikipedia, and if you quite simply learn how to play the game..." (33:54).

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Adminis...

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#45

Post by [deleted] »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

So to summarize: he resuggested "WikiProject Intellectual Diversity", a group with the goal to make "Wikipedia more intellectually diverse" and "ensure fair and open decision-making and governance, broaden the range of permissible sources, reinforce genuine neutrality, rein in over-aggressive blocking while holding the powerful to higher standards of accountability", etc, with the implied undertone of preventing Wiki…

[deleted]

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#47

Post by roenxi »

More than whatever process was used, just looking at his user page I do think some sort of ostracism-like response was inevitable. The thing about communities like Wikipedia is when you have a group of volunteers coming together to do something the culture has to be somewhat intolerant of cultural change, otherwise it'll fall apart pretty quickly. To repeat that another way, culture defines who is part of the in- and out-group, so once the group has formed it is very slow to change or the group collapses.

I quite like what he's going for with these 9 theses - the ideas of the public rating articles or enabling competition between articles seems like a clever compromise position - but frankly I don't see how the Wikipedia community could treat this as anything other than an attack whether or not the ideas are improvements. The parallel with Martin Luther and the Catholic Church was appropriately foreshadowed by Sanger.

Organisations eventually become corrupt. Wikipedia might already be there or it might have a ways to go, who knows. But this sort of change might require a new project or some sort of schism among the Wikipedia editors, it sounds pretty radical. Especially in the post-Trump era; I expect his presidency has been a traumatic era for the English Wikipedia project.

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#48

Post by chollida1 »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

So to summarize: he resuggested "WikiProject Intellectual Diversity", a group with the goal to make "Wikipedia more intellectually diverse" and "ensure fair and open decision-making and governance, broaden the range of permissible sources, reinforce genuine neutrality, rein in over-aggressive blocking while holding the powerful to higher standards of accountability", etc, with the implied undertone of preventing Wiki…

> But then he made a tweet that basically just says "I suggested this, some people like it, some hate it". That's super against the rules, because it attracts people to the proposal who otherwise wouldn't have seen it.

How would this in any way be against the rules? Wouldn'tan open and democratic process like wikipedia want as many eyes as possible on a vote or rule change?

That sounds completely backwards from the open and free spirit of wikipedia. If even wikipedia has gone full mob rule then hwo do any projects stay open and free to everyone?

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#49

Post by fortran77 »

croes wrote: post #34
dotancohen wrote: post #8

Many of his essays have been deleted, and many others are Pending Deletion. Those deleted can be viewed only by admins. There is a large movement to censor this guy's opinions and undo his contributions. What happened? There is no explicit mention on the page.

>There is a large movement to censor this guy's opinions Wikipedia is the wrong place for opinions

Don’t make me spit out my coffee!

Re: Wikipedia cofounder Larry Sanger blocked from editing Wikipedia

#50

Post by afh1 »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

So to summarize: he resuggested "WikiProject Intellectual Diversity", a group with the goal to make "Wikipedia more intellectually diverse" and "ensure fair and open decision-making and governance, broaden the range of permissible sources, reinforce genuine neutrality, rein in over-aggressive blocking while holding the powerful to higher standards of accountability", etc, with the implied undertone of preventing Wiki…

Yes, banned by the status quo for trying to disturb it. Wikipedia is nowadays highly politicized and more time and energy are spent on politics than on actually contributing with any useful knowledge. I've stopped contributing years ago after a decade of writing because of how bad things had gotten. It's a lost battle, all that remains is scorched earth filled with toxic editors trying to push their POV and banning everyone who exposes them or attempts to change things.
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