Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022) • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#91

Post by furyofantares » Mon, Jun 22, 2026, 2:21 PM UTC

caminante wrote: post #90

furyofantares wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The parent's point is that lighting a fuse and saying you'll do something when the fuse runs out regardless of the boss' approval in a situation where you want to run something by them...is career suicide. It's not, if that action is a part of your job, something you COULD do just on your own but "you want a bit of reassurance or to let the boss know what you are up to". It's not really a notification on a fuse, th…

You left out: > ask them for permission I humbly submit you're still glossing over this. This framing is subtle. There's a difference between getting a peer review from your boss and asking your boss for permission when you think you might need it. Trust your gut. Compare that to situations where you just want peer review/re-assurance. I agree with you on those situations to just pull the trigger.

The article is saying don't ask for permission! They're not really recommending anything different than what I see you saying throughout this thread.

They are saying it's common to ask permission in cases where you shouldn't, because it's actually your job and you only want a bit of reassurance / to give advanced notice.

Maybe you haven't run across people who do that, but that is what the author is responding to.

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#92

Post by 6P58r3MXJSLi » Mon, Jun 22, 2026, 4:35 PM UTC

6P58r3MXJSLi wrote: post #84

GMoromisato wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to hear an example of a successful communist state. You can even restrict it to a limited period in time (USSR 1959-1968 or something). I promise that I will not try to discredit your answer. I'm just curious what people think. But if you come back with "the communism I have in mind hasn't been tried yet" then I will definitely make fun of your answer.

> I would love to hear an example of a successful communist state. Basically, all of them They were so successful that the west (meaning mainly the U.S. and the Brits) have invested gigantic amounts of resources in fighting them. Imagine what they could have done for their citizens instead... And yet, communist ideas are still alive and kicking, while capitalism is hated everywhere, not only by the people living in a…

it's so funny when the stupid americans (from the U.S.A, because America is the whole continent and it's full of very intelligent people) can't stand that communism won over capitalism a century ago.

Communism won, you heard it right, because it still means to the *whole World* freedom and empowerment of the working classes, except for stupid americans - there are intelligent americans, mind you.

maybe a link with images and a voice over will be easier to understand for people like you

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DZ0k_07Tqse/?igsh=MWVmcndnNzR...

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#93

Post by caminante » Mon, Jun 22, 2026, 5:04 PM UTC

furyofantares wrote: post #91

caminante wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You left out: > ask them for permission I humbly submit you're still glossing over this. This framing is subtle. There's a difference between getting a peer review from your boss and asking your boss for permission when you think you might need it. Trust your gut. Compare that to situations where you just want peer review/re-assurance. I agree with you on those situations to just pull the trigger.

The article is saying don't ask for permission! They're not really recommending anything different than what I see you saying throughout this thread. They are saying it's common to ask permission in cases where you shouldn't, because it's actually your job and you only want a bit of reassurance / to give advanced notice. Maybe you haven't run across people who do that, but that is what the author is responding to.

I agree directionally and appreciate your effort. I might just be misunderstanding and wrong, which forgive me if you feel like that's the case.

I just don't find the author's point consistent or nuanced about when to apply this (e.g., the size of the changes, the interface with your manager, the supervision/trust relationship).

Look at the closing sentence of the article.

"Offering a chance for feedback" when you're confident that "you don't need feedback" is weird. This is like some paradox. And doesn't match the phrasing of his initial example. This is bad advice that is way overdoing it.

> Again, pursue this approach [...] when you want to offer a chance for feedback, but you are confident enough in the course of action that you don’t need feedback.

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#94

Post by port11 » Mon, Jun 22, 2026, 7:11 PM UTC

torben-friis wrote: post #23

notatoad wrote: post #13

i think the reason this works is an implication that the article doesn't explicitly cover: if you tell somebody you're going to to do something, you're not asking them to take responsibility. you're telling them that you're taking responsibility for whatever you're going to do. If you ask somebody's permission, you're asking them to take some portion of responsibility for what you're doing. which is the same risk tha…

Absolutely! This is a point that tends to kill introverted/insecure people I think. They assume that asking for permission is making things easier for people, but there's a limit where you're not allowing others to delegate responsibility onto you. Your job is for others to not have to think about the things you take care of.

You’re conflating introversion with agreeableness and neuroticism or even social shyness. Introversion is its own aspect.

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#95

Post by gacgacgac » Tue, Jun 23, 2026, 2:10 AM UTC

pepa65 wrote: post #73

gacgacgac wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you can look at different lenses of success. Vietnam successfully defeated a much, much more powerful imperial force. They have fewer freedoms, and are still recovering from the generational damage dealt to them, and they are hardly without plenty of valid criticisms. But they've had successes. China is a major global power. I think you'd have to accept that China is successful , even if that success doesn't…

Currently, what are the countries that are most primarily focused on the welfare of their people? Those I would consider good countries.

Nordics, Costa Rica, Australia and New Zealand.

Re: Ask for no, don't ask for yes (2022)

#96

Post by IIsi50MHz » Wed, Jun 24, 2026, 1:32 AM UTC

smugglerFlynn wrote: post #78

jdlshore wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very strident response, presented with a lot of confidence, and I think that confidence is unwarranted. I haven’t read the article, so maybe it’s been covered, but here’s a simple way I usually “ask for no.” I send a message on Slack: “Hey (name), I’m planning to (do a thing) on Wednesday. Let me know if you have concerns.” It doesn’t come across as usurping authority, or sneaky, or any of the other very it…

The culture you are creating is actually the opposite: no ownership, and no autonomy You are delegating decisions that are in your responsibility to another person (=no ownership), and you are not able to progress unless someone else [even if silently] green lights your approach (=no autonomy). Another similar management anti-pattern is “please copy me on all your communications” [for a chance to override your decisi…

Disagree. If this VP is delegating to direct reports things they should be capable of handling, that's normal. If a direct report informs this VP of intended action, it both keeps the VP informed and acknowledges that the VP might have other information that should alter the intended course.

I'm assuming a trusted, competent direct report, and that the DR has chosen a timeframe that is reasonable give the situation.

For example:

Customer has a problem that will cause them to miss payroll on Friday. We've known about it since Tuesday morning. VP, DR & team spent Tuesday understanding the underlying problems.

VP has found one of the issues is in a third-party product, who are notably resistant to believing they have a bug, and are prone to not deploying a fix until either the next major update or three months after first report. VP is working on a software fix that makes use of another esoteric behaviour of the third-party product to potentially prevent the current problem from recurring, but now expects to not be done before Thursday.

DR & team spent Wednesday testing, and believe they can ensure payroll will be ontime by deploying a workaround Wednesday night, during the customer's existing maintenance window, where customer's I.T. group are known to be available for this issue. DP sends email to VP with intended course of action and known caveats.

VP knows he can keep working on the longterm fix without the customer's ability to make payroll hinging on it.

. o O ( The above actually happened, approximately thrice, due to different vendors committing shenanigans. It is abstracted from different customers. )