Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 150 posts

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#111

Post by 28304283409234 »

Aurornis wrote: post #59

The only way to force sites to exclude children is to have them ID everyone. This is why forcing each site to restrict access is a terrible idea. It’s a backdoor to destroying everyone’s privacy. What we really need is for each of these sites to advertise its category or age targets, similar to how TV shows have a rating. Then end user devices like phones and browsers should have the option of setting parental contro…

I agree that the sollution is terrible. That does not make the actual problem go away though. There are real world, actual problems caused by social media used by children. And individual parents, and children, are no match for the Googles of this world.

So what better option can we think of, us smart people here?

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#112

Post by big85 »

inigyou wrote: post #98
big85 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then enable parental controls on your children's devices. But don't enable it on my device, because I'm an adult.

There are no working parental controls. Have you tried? Because nobody is incentivized to make them work. The California law basically mandates devices (including Linux) to have a parental controls mode and mandates apps to obey them under penalty of law.

This is bizarre, then, because the on-device Apple system just enables the existing parental controls by default, while the online verification systems are easily cirvumvented.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#113

Post by inigyou »

big85 wrote: post #112
inigyou wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are no working parental controls. Have you tried? Because nobody is incentivized to make them work. The California law basically mandates devices (including Linux) to have a parental controls mode and mandates apps to obey them under penalty of law.

This is bizarre, then, because the on-device Apple system just enables the existing parental controls by default, while the online verification systems are easily cirvumvented.

How do Apple parental controls work?

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#114

Post by inigyou »

_AzMoo wrote: post #108
inigyou wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think there could be explicitly child-friendly social media? I don't know how you'd get past the network effect, but could it work? Maybe adults would have to set up groups, and connections could only be established with Bluetooth or something to ensure physical proximity (yes you could cheat but you'd need weird hardware or software to do so). Adults setting up groups would be so that you could have a group f…

It'd be fine if they were just using chat apps. It's not the communication that's the problem, or the bullying. That's going to happen regardless, and it's nothing new to online spaces. If anything, having online spaces available is helpful, because kids who are excluded at school are able to find places they fit in online. It's the algorithmic feeds and short-form video content. It's flooding their brains in their m…

I think being contacted by or contacting strangers is also a separate concern. Bullying is also a problem.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#115

Post by inigyou »

pcrh wrote: post #107
inigyou wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Websites mix content far more than TV shows do. Think about the Twitter home page (back when it was Twitter). If someone tweeted something that should be restricted, what do you suggest? Mark the whole page over-18 and effectively ban kids from using Twitter until it falls off the front page? That's ridiculous. Ban people from tweeting over-18 content or hide it from everything except direct links? This is what Twitt…

Kids don't need Twitter. There would obviously arise a market for a moderated, or more regulated, version of this type of social media. Social media doesn't deserve an exemption from the efforts society makes to protect children in other domains.

So basically you just ban any company from serving both kids and porn stars, no matter how hard they keep them separated? This is one of the avenues people often go down to censor the porn industry. You're effectively doing "think of the children! ban porn!" without doing it explicitly.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#116

Post by padjo »

Aurornis wrote: post #59

The only way to force sites to exclude children is to have them ID everyone. This is why forcing each site to restrict access is a terrible idea. It’s a backdoor to destroying everyone’s privacy. What we really need is for each of these sites to advertise its category or age targets, similar to how TV shows have a rating. Then end user devices like phones and browsers should have the option of setting parental contro…

Is that the only way? It seems conceivable to me that you could have some sort of publicly run infrastructure that asserts your age is above some threshold without sharing your identity. So long as that system recorded no log of who asked it for assertions about whom then I can't see an objection to age verification.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#117

Post by big85 »

WithinReason wrote: post #64
big85 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's still the issue of how to verify the user to give them that 1 bit. The current tools do not trust the user or the user's device, because the user could lie or modify the software on their device. But once my ID leaves the device, it becomes a privacy issue. You also have the problem that every pre-2026 device no longer functions with any site that requires the 1 bit.

Isn't this already a solved issue in crypto? You just need 1 trusted website to verify your identity and sign your bit. Instead of having to trust every website.

Indeed. I don't see why the verification process has to be done once per user per website, instead of once per user. That maximizes costs, inconvenience, privacy risks, and compliance failures.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#118

Post by el_io »

inigyou wrote: post #100
el_io wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe get good at parenting?

This is what we call a "thought-terminating cliché"

Call it what you want, but spoiling children with digital devices before they can even talk properly and then trying to forcing everyone to upload their ID to random server (which will sell/leak that) is definitely a parenting issue.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#119

Post by Palmik »

28304283409234 wrote: post #110
roenxi wrote: post #7

In Australia, back in 2021, we had a senior politician run out of politics because a relatively small-time YouTuber just wouldn't shut up about his connections to organised crime. And friendlyjordies house was eventually firebombed by the organised criminals too, so that was interesting. Now obviously one bad apple doesn't spoil the whole bunch [0] but it always struck me as the sort of thing that would ruffle feathe…

While an interesting story I fail to see the connection between it, and the negative impact social media has on children.

By requiring various forms of identification to use social media, it will be harder to criticize your leaders anonymously without fear of retribution.

Re: From Australia to Europe, countries move to curb children's social media access

#120

Post by pibaker »

pcrh wrote: post #107
inigyou wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Websites mix content far more than TV shows do. Think about the Twitter home page (back when it was Twitter). If someone tweeted something that should be restricted, what do you suggest? Mark the whole page over-18 and effectively ban kids from using Twitter until it falls off the front page? That's ridiculous. Ban people from tweeting over-18 content or hide it from everything except direct links? This is what Twitt…

Kids don't need Twitter. There would obviously arise a market for a moderated, or more regulated, version of this type of social media. Social media doesn't deserve an exemption from the efforts society makes to protect children in other domains.

Who do you trust to moderate a platform like twitter? Its current owner? The US government?
Post reply on HN