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W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

blog.elenarossini.com

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Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#21

Post by jeromegv »

colesantiago wrote: post #11
jwr wrote: post #3

I don't understand why anyone would want to make the same mistake all over again: jumping onto a private platform owned by a company inevitably results in you becoming the product sold and enshittification. We've seen it so many times. Learn the lesson. Use Mastodon this time.

Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon. Also Mastodon is on the road to enshittification since the previous CEO and founder bowed out for $1M using donations and the main instance federates with Meta's Threads. The other instances are out of the question since one rogue instance owner can lock and shutdown that instance.

Threads is just another node that connects to ActivityPub, there is no "road" to enshittification.

Mastodon is independant, each instance manages itself, some are bad, some are good, you can even host your own, that's the power of decentralization.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#23

Post by angst_ridden »

colesantiago wrote: post #11
jwr wrote: post #3

I don't understand why anyone would want to make the same mistake all over again: jumping onto a private platform owned by a company inevitably results in you becoming the product sold and enshittification. We've seen it so many times. Learn the lesson. Use Mastodon this time.

Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon. Also Mastodon is on the road to enshittification since the previous CEO and founder bowed out for $1M using donations and the main instance federates with Meta's Threads. The other instances are out of the question since one rogue instance owner can lock and shutdown that instance.

Tell me you don't understand the point of Mastodon without telling me you don't understand the point of Mastodon.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#24

Post by danabramov »

mort96 wrote: post #13
afavour wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

atproto is also open source and in my experience (solely as a user rather than a developer on the API/network) it simply works better than Mastodon.

And what is that experience of yours? Do you have experience from deployments with many independent atproto data servers and relays federating together? Or do you have experience from bluesky, meaning you're only interacting with one central server and none of the complexities of federation come into play?

That’s like saying that someone using Google Reader doesn’t “experience federation of RSS”.

Yes, my experience using the Bluesky app includes the Bluesky app server aggregating from many independent PDS hosts (because people I follow like that). But it doesn’t show up in user experience because that’s the whole point.

And yes, I can use another aggregator instead of the Bluesky app, or even use a client which has no backend and relies on community-run Constellation index. It all roughly works the same.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#25

Post by colesantiago »

jeromegv wrote: post #21
colesantiago wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon. Also Mastodon is on the road to enshittification since the previous CEO and founder bowed out for $1M using donations and the main instance federates with Meta's Threads. The other instances are out of the question since one rogue instance owner can lock and shutdown that instance.

Threads is just another node that connects to ActivityPub, there is no "road" to enshittification. Mastodon is independant, each instance manages itself, some are bad, some are good, you can even host your own, that's the power of decentralization.

With this logic, Threads is the biggest 'Mastodon instance' with 500M active users monthly.

Why aren't the general public using the original first 'instance' which is Mastodon if it is just another node?

> Mastodon is independant, each instance manages itself, some are bad, some are good, you can even host your own, that's the power of decentralization.

I think this is where it falls apart.

Nobody wants to waste their time host your own, moving from a rouge instance, trying to search for users to follow and the worst one:

Choosing which instance to sign up to.

It is no wonder that even Bluesky is more active than Mastodon.

If I was going to tell someone what social media to sign up to other than X, it has to be either Threads or Bluesky.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#26

Post by Aachen »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #18
Aachen wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you know there's nobody worth following on Mastodon?

I was on mastodon for a year, and the only people there were other dorks looking for someone to follow on mastodon

Huh, okay. For me there's everything from government updates to industry news to friends and acquaintances active on Mastodon. Meeting new people there as well. Maybe infosec and my friends are just all dorks

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#27

Post by colesantiago »

angst_ridden wrote: post #23
colesantiago wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon. Also Mastodon is on the road to enshittification since the previous CEO and founder bowed out for $1M using donations and the main instance federates with Meta's Threads. The other instances are out of the question since one rogue instance owner can lock and shutdown that instance.

Tell me you don't understand the point of Mastodon without telling me you don't understand the point of Mastodon.

> Tell me you don't understand the point of Mastodon without telling me you don't understand the point of Mastodon.

Yes, many people don't understand the point of Mastodon.

This includes many of the hundreds of users who tried to make Mastodon work as an X alternative but failed because it was too hard to use.

Decentralisation, Federation, self hosting and choosing an instance isn't enough of a point for many people to use it.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#28

Post by soco »

jwr wrote: post #19
mglvsky wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd go further - just leave social media

No, not necessarily. Mastodon is actually "social media", as opposed to twitter/X, bluewhatever, facebook, or any other commercial outlet, to be honest, all of these have become "feeds" of promoted content designed to maximize "engagement". Mastodon is social: you follow people, you see their stuff. It's what social media used to be.

Which is what eYou is trying to build as well. Including AI fact-checking: far from perfect but interesting to read its fact checks on your own posts.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#29

Post by zerobees »

colesantiago wrote: post #11
jwr wrote: post #3

I don't understand why anyone would want to make the same mistake all over again: jumping onto a private platform owned by a company inevitably results in you becoming the product sold and enshittification. We've seen it so many times. Learn the lesson. Use Mastodon this time.

Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon. Also Mastodon is on the road to enshittification since the previous CEO and founder bowed out for $1M using donations and the main instance federates with Meta's Threads. The other instances are out of the question since one rogue instance owner can lock and shutdown that instance.

> Nobody important or worth following uses Mastodon.

So? I don't use social media to receive curated, hourly dispatches from Barack Obama or Taylor Swift (or, more likely, their account managers). And it might feel important to get the latest rage bait and memes from Elon - it's almost like being friends with the world's first trillionaire - but is it really a good use of your time?

I think a healthier way to use social media is to have two-way interactions with some reasonably stable social circle; less about "people who matter" and more about "people who matter to you". Mastodon certainly has the critical mass to make this possible.

Re: W Social, public institutions and the theater of European digital sovereignty

#30

Post by oytis »

colesantiago wrote: post #25
jeromegv wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Threads is just another node that connects to ActivityPub, there is no "road" to enshittification. Mastodon is independant, each instance manages itself, some are bad, some are good, you can even host your own, that's the power of decentralization.

With this logic, Threads is the biggest 'Mastodon instance' with 500M active users monthly. Why aren't the general public using the original first 'instance' which is Mastodon if it is just another node? > Mastodon is independant, each instance manages itself, some are bad, some are good, you can even host your own, that's the power of decentralization. I think this is where it falls apart. Nobody wants to waste thei…

Practically, if you choose a big enough server, it's rarely a problem. mastodon.social is the most popular one, maintained by Mastodon the non-profit itself.

Biggest turn off and a killer feature depending on who you ask is a lack of Algorithm. That's why people who move away from Twitter feel disoriented, but people who were never on Twitter in the first place are alright.

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