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US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

reuters.com

271–280 of 633 posts

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This person is correct. I pay for 2 servers running in Asia under Alibaba, using my local CVS drugstore. Im in the Midwest USA. Not a single problem at all.

Sorry, I am not familiar with Alipay, at least in the use case you're referring to; How do you exactly pay for 2 servers using Alipay from a CVS?

I can load US dollars I hand over to the CVS attendant and load it on my AliPay (Alibaba account).

I can then pay my Alibaba server bills with Alipay.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#273
post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok I'll bite: what is the obvious thing I'm supposed to be getting from your ellipses? are you implying there is a US-based, third-party provider of xiaomi devices, BYD cars? or are you just referring to hosted providers of those AI models?

> what is the obvious thing I'm supposed to be getting from your ellipses? Well, I'm unsure if it's a correct form of expression in English, but in my native language ellipses can often serve to express speaker/writer feeling of uncertainty about something or some kind of sadness/apathy/similar towards the situation being discussed. It's not about some "obvious thing you should get", sorry for misunderstanding. > or…

No worries, I was just confused, and in part was genuinely wondering if there was a vendor that sold xiaomis in the states because I'd buy one.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#274
post #18

Noteworthy that Z.ai, maker of the just released near-frontier GLM 5.2, has already been on the Entity List since Jan 2025[1]. Being on the Entity List does not mean all trade is forbidden. Broadly speaking it means American companies and individuals are not allowed sell them goods and services, but they are still allowed to buy from them and pay them. AFAIK the Chinese AI companies barely depend on US goods and serv…

How does that even work? If Z.ai wants to buy lets say GPUs for AI training, what's stopping them from going to a local reseller? Its not even circumventing the rules, its the natural thing to do. For that matter, does (only) NVIDIA make datacenter cards? When I buy a gaming card, I dont buy from NVIDIA, I buy from an integrator, like Gigabyte, who work with a company like Foxconn to make the cards.

[deleted]

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#275
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to annexation, China doesn't threaten, they just invade and extinguish.

Yeah, I remember clearly when China invaded/bombed: Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Venezuela, Panama, Syria...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Vietnamese_War

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#276
post #256
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to annexation, China doesn't threaten, they just invade and extinguish.

Could you give me some examples? Which wars do you have in mind?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Tibet_by_the_Peo...

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#277

If Chinese LLMs are successfully making people in the west defend China, then I think we have all the evidence we need to explain why they are giving away their models. The next step of course will be to get people using that ungodly cheap AI on Chinese servers. Which will also be defended because "I would never trust an American Lab".

> get people using that ungodly cheap AI on Chinese servers.

These open weights models are also hosted outside of the US and China. That's a very important difference.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#278

If Chinese LLMs are successfully making people in the west defend China, then I think we have all the evidence we need to explain why they are giving away their models. The next step of course will be to get people using that ungodly cheap AI on Chinese servers. Which will also be defended because "I would never trust an American Lab".

It's funny how you can look at obscenely overvalued Western AI companies, with capex's that are unsustainable, and along comes a system which pokes a gaping hole in this model, and the response is "Ya, but what do those sneaky Chinese have up their sleeve here?!" Perhaps the question should instead be "Why are these Western AI companies getting insane valuations on dubious ROI, and how can these Chinese models run on…

The main cost is training the first version of model. It is very easy to just train the copy cat model based on the output of another model.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#279
post #256
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to annexation, China doesn't threaten, they just invade and extinguish.

Could you give me some examples? Which wars do you have in mind?

Tibet, Manchuria, it should be somewhat obvious that a nation that is as ethnically diverse as China was not a nation borne out of lots of different people deciding simultaneously that they would like to create a country together.

What is modern China has only existed for 100 years or so. When the country collapsed there were ethnic divisions that were erased after the country was unified.

The hallmark of successful ethnic cleansing is people claiming that there were never any wars, that things were always this way. The same is true of Kaliningrad, the most German city, centuries of history as a leading nation within Germany and the HRE, now a completely Russian city. It is only in the West that you see any narrative around division, in places like China or Russia history is erased (and how could it be any other way, the cornerstone of Chinese politics is one nation, one people...there is no political value in this narrative in Western countries).

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#280
post #12

The US government exists to defend capital interests. It's why we can't buy BYD cars. It's why we can't import any cars unless they're 25 years old. It's why a Tiktok sale was forced. It's why the US is seeking to block states from banning prediction markets. It's why the federal government is seeking to block states from blocking data center projects. As soon as DeepSeek came out I realized what was going on: China…

Chinese have a wider outlook on it. Politically they believe AI belongs to humanity, which is why they are basically the only ones left publishing research in the open. That's probably part of their socialist nature. But also a financial one. They believe that models are commodities, that you can swap one for the other and that the only thing that matters are the applications built upon them. So they want to make sur…

Well yeah humanity in the sense of everyone except maybe Uyghurs, Tibetans, Mongols, ... I mean open models are really cool, but I have a hard time believing China is doing it purely for the greater good. The commoditizing your complement story sounds much more plausible.
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