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There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

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Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#501

Post by artisin »

AlexeyBelov wrote: post #494
not_a_bot_4sho wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious. What did you build? Sounds like you might have an interesting "Show HN" post on your hands

Nothing. They built nothing. Proof: I've build a trillion dollar company.

19 days ago: "I worked at a large fintech moving billions of dollars in volume a day."

10 days ago: "I'm an indie filmmaker and I do community theater."

Today: "I've built one $2.5 million annualized run rate company"

For us, mere mortals, it may be impossible, but for @echelon anything is possible.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#502

Post by reasonableklout »

robeym wrote: post #496

Having used and watched others use Fable, it's clear to me that the standard of care for these models done by Anthropic pre-release was nothing like their previous releases. It seemed like shortcuts were taken to get it released. Maybe the models are changing faster than their team can adapt, and maybe the government responded as quickly as they did because of their relationship with Anthropic. Regardless, I think re…

How was this release more rushed than previous ones?

I have the opposite impression using Fable, behavior-wise it is much more polished than Opus 4.7 was at launch.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#503

Post by _heimdall »

inigyou wrote: post #361
bombcar wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A huge part of the problem is that we’ve made everything so big that we have a choice between the dragon and the hydra. Fight for localization.

Do you think robber barons will have a problem becoming bigger than local?

Do you propose that we try to robber baron better than them instead?

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#504

Post by coldtea »

Guvante wrote: post #480
coldtea wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can be critical of the policy of export controls and the meaning of them in modern day but saying it is a problem with the government in general is nonsensical. Hardly non-sensical. You just have a different default.

Government has control by virtue of existing. If you say government control is bad in general you are just saying there shouldn't be government. This is impossible as the things the government does will happen it would just be under a different label. That is all I meant by non-sensical, you need to be more specific to have a real point.

>This is impossible as the things the government does will happen it would just be under a different label.

Nope, we could just do 1/10th of the things "the government does".

Not all them are needed, and a lot of them are actively harmful.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#505

Post by jrowen »

boppo1 wrote: post #208
jrowen wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like it could be a law that there is essentially no way to guarantee that AI is any more or less safe than humans. It kinda seems incompatible with what we understand to be "intelligence" which arguably requires a certain unpredictable freedom...Has a method of "baking in" such safety features even been conceptualized? Or is it just a matter of nurturing/raising/policing them after the fact and hoping for the…

>Kind of taking this a step further, what is the worst thing that an AI run amok could do to existentially threaten the human race? Probably convincing humans that untrue things are true. Think less "AI launches nukes" and more "AI convinces people in country A that country B is trying to subvert & destroy them, while it does the same for country B wrt A."

I mean, that's a tale as old as time. That's humans, not AI.

Has the internet enabled more people to be more educated and informed, or has it enabled echo chambers of misinformation? I don't think it's demonstrable that it's not a wash. Technology is an extension, a mirror...we need to fix ourselves, AI is not the problem.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#506

Post by trimethylpurine »

dxdm wrote: post #491
trimethylpurine wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh everything you said makes sense so long as I imagine wrongly that everyone is doing what's best for society, and that's why they got into politics. But politics is really about negotiating ownership in companies that the politician will approve for government projects. And if you aren't doing that, then no other politicians will care to work with you, because it's not profitable for them. You'll be an irrelevant p…

Well, you could stop undermining what you seem to care for. You don't have to "wrongly imagine" anything. Everyone not doing what's "best for society" is how the world works, authoritarianism and the rule of rich elites is the default that everything wants to regress to. There are only ever islands where people managed to push this back towards the corners and make room for more of us. Human societies have taken mill…

I didn't say I don't care. I vote locally, in every election. And I often speak with lobbyists that are friends and acquaintances.

You think people pointing out problems in a broken system are the problem.

Respectfully then, YOU'RE the problem. Before you decide to fix something, you ought to stop and ask what people have already tried.

That's called team work.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#507

Post by dpe82 »

boppo1 wrote: post #230
dpe82 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would foreign (relative to the US) models suddenly sit still? There's enormous incentive to improve; surely they'll be able to figure out how just like their American counterparts? We've seen this movie before with crypto export bans in the 90s. The rest of the world caught up and then surpassed the US very quickly - and that was without the enormous financial incentives of AI.

The US will try to ban them, for being too dangerous or for being an IP violation[0] of some companies we've deemed too big to fail. [0] lmao how ironic

That wouldn't stop their development and use in the rest of the world...

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#508

Post by Valakas_ »

boppo1 wrote: post #204
jeroenhd wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, generative AI is wrecking society in new and unexpected ways every week. From lies and misinformation to people choosing chatbots over therapy and relationships, there's a profound impact on society that will only get worse in the coming years. The look for junior programmers who are capable enough to get anything done when the AI is down has been depressing, and things are looking much worse for the year…

AI is often better than therapy as reported by users. Therapy has some inherent dark-patterns that AI doesn't have yet, like the therapist's financial incentive to trickle a solution to your problem to preserve their income.

Also the amount of therapists that have the potential to retraumatize patients due to their own unresolved traumas (often to the point of them having personality disorders) cannot be overstated.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#509

Post by robeym »

reasonableklout wrote: post #502
robeym wrote: post #496

Having used and watched others use Fable, it's clear to me that the standard of care for these models done by Anthropic pre-release was nothing like their previous releases. It seemed like shortcuts were taken to get it released. Maybe the models are changing faster than their team can adapt, and maybe the government responded as quickly as they did because of their relationship with Anthropic. Regardless, I think re…

How was this release more rushed than previous ones? I have the opposite impression using Fable, behavior-wise it is much more polished than Opus 4.7 was at launch.

I think it felt more polished, otherwise they wouldn't have released it. Fable took more shortcuts, lied more, had stabilizing safeguards removed, and just did what it wanted more than other models.

Re: There is a shadow hanging over this Fable thing

#510

Post by dxdm »

trimethylpurine wrote: post #506
dxdm wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you could stop undermining what you seem to care for. You don't have to "wrongly imagine" anything. Everyone not doing what's "best for society" is how the world works, authoritarianism and the rule of rich elites is the default that everything wants to regress to. There are only ever islands where people managed to push this back towards the corners and make room for more of us. Human societies have taken mill…

I didn't say I don't care. I vote locally, in every election. And I often speak with lobbyists that are friends and acquaintances. You think people pointing out problems in a broken system are the problem. Respectfully then, YOU'RE the problem. Before you decide to fix something, you ought to stop and ask what people have already tried. That's called team work.

> You think people pointing out problems in a broken system are the problem.

Not what I said, nor does it follow from what I said. Also, not really what you were doing. There's a difference between pointing out problems, or using the existence of problems to trash the reputation of something or someone. Problems are easy to find. It's a convenient excuse to hide behind. But in the end, you can tell from how things are being presented and contextualized, and from what conclusion is actually being promoted.

I'm not going to keep discussing this with you. I think I've done enough to counter this corrosive narrative, no matter where it comes from.

If you're genuine and you do in fact care, you might want to ponder what you're doing, and if it's making things better or worse.

Have a nice day.

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