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Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

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Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#551

Post by [deleted] »

I_am_tiberius wrote: post #316
codingdave wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is the only way it is legal. This was an export directive from the Commerce department, using authority granted by Congress to control exports of tech. If they just told Anthropic to shut down a model without invoking an emergency order of export, there would be no legal authority for such an order. Keep in mind that for all the troubles and trauma caused by the current USA government, they are really good at ma…

Ok, but then the government's argumentation doesn't make sense? If the reason for shutting it down is that it's dangerous, only shutting it down for non US citizens doesn't solve the problem.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#552

Post by vineyardmike »

mlrtime wrote: post #549
hilariously wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably using the rule of law in some way? Talking about it in public? Legislating? You know... government type stuff?

[flagged]

Refusing to enact new laws around a thing most people don’t like, don’t want, and don’t care about (oh and is used for scams often) is quite different than a secret back door war.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#553

Post by drawfloat »

ionwake wrote: post #280

Im not trying to be weird... but as someone in Europe.... are we toast? no more AI access ever again?

Honestly it might not be the worst thing. Facebook et al were way too entrenched in European society before the geopolitical negatives became apparent. Getting cut off now, regardless of whether it comes back tomorrow, will encourage not being overly reliant on one country’s LLM providers.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#554

Post by b112 »

rustyhancock wrote: post #545
themgt wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I submitted separately, but this Axios report has some details that call a lot of the speculation in this thread into question, i.e. that this wasn't much of a "jailbreak" at all and that it's not Anthropic-specific - the White House intends to generally regulate Mythos-class models (whatever exactly that means): Between the lines: The government's response "seems way out of line with what's actually in the research…

> the White House intends to generally regulate Mythos-class models (whatever exactly that means) This is not at all surprising. And I hope people don't make the mistake that it's a "this administration" problem. It was obviously from the early days of these LLMs that the shoe was going to drop and we (as Joe public) would not retain access. I mean that once ChatGPT3 dropped it was clear there was some level of funct…

Yet unlike CPUs/GPUs, there's currently zero way to lock down who has access.

Giving access to 'citizens', with the current way the Internet operates, is absurd. One back door into a desktop, workstation, and 'validated citizens' are now 'hackers from where-ever'.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#555

Post by JumpCrisscross »

Lerc wrote: post #272
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I speak to journalists, I am always on deep background. I’ll point them to people who can corroborate. But they’ll be off the record. Refusing anything but named sources in one’s information diet is fine, but most people I know who do this are remarkably inconsistent on the other axis, source quality, accepting names randos on Twitter as the word of god while rejecting respected journalism because Congressional…

I don't mind anonymous sources provided there is a clear assertion by the journalist that the source witnessed or had direct evidence of the thing being disclosed. Anything that, should the information be wrong, reveals that either the journalist or the source was lying. A source 'familiar with' does not reach that bar. "A source who wishes to remain anonymous witnessed..." Is acceptable. "Subject disclosed to an ano…

Eh, this is a silly bar for evidence. I'm sure someone can find a way to functionally operate in the world at it. But most people can't, and certainly not anyone with any influence. There is value in hearing suppositions. Hypotheses. Even if they haven't yet been proved. In part because airing that laundry sometimes helps prove or disprove them.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#556

Post by zkmon »

Ah - that sounds natural. An infra and services company, with the knowledge of the security gaps on their hosted stuff would ofcourse ask for banning of tools that can expose the weaknesses of it's infra, services and apps. But the only issue is, the same level of tools might be available from other places. I could see AWS becoming unexpected target of AI.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#557

Post by onel »

aix1 wrote: post #2

Given Amazon's fairly large equity stake in Anthropic, I really don't get their motivation. Anyone care to speculate?

I'm pretty sure this was an unintended consequences. They received the report from anthropic and just shared it with the government without thinking that it might cause this.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#558

Post by [deleted] »

w10-1 wrote: post #399

I don't think this is Amazon targeting Anthropic, but the government shaking down Anthropic using Amazon. The government is a key customer of Amazon, so Amazon will provide cover as needed. Amazon knows their equity stake in Anthropic is not particularly at risk, and they only gain negotiating power by looping in the feds. Security is a real concern. Security experts within the government should create public+private…

[deleted]

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#559

Post by softwaredoug »

derektank wrote: post #471
softwaredoug wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t really matter what party does it The ideal case is a statutory agency with regulatory authority that sets very clear standards for what model capabilities can and cannot release. Those are set ahead of time and well known by frontier model providers. Most normal regulations are managed through the administrative procedures act process. That’s a legal requirement that involves deliberation and public commen…

I wholeheartedly agree with what you’re saying in general. I do wonder though, given how rapid advancements in AI are occurring, if even an agency with statutory authority would be able to establish a predictable regulatory environment, let alone do so while maintaining a lengthy public comment period and a whole of government approach. There are obvious flaws with the current administration’s approach to, well, almo…

Nothing being talked about with Mythos wasn’t a known AI risk 12 months ago. Those rules could have been established to guide frontier labs.

But yes crazy things happen. Maybe it won’t catch everything.

The right answer are giving the govt / this agency explicit legal, short term model pause capabilities to let the rule making process happen if something completely out of band happens. Or let the agency study/approve models prior to release.

Not sudden, unexpected application of export laws.

Yet in this case, for Fable, cybersecurity risks have been well know for some time. A rule created years ago when we knew this would happen could have given frontier labs and the market predictability.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#560

Post by throw__away7391 »

olyjohn wrote: post #256
throw__away7391 wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well they happen in schools and children don’t vote. If this had been a wave of senior center shootings, something would have been done a long, long time ago.

This is not a good argument. Children tend to have parents who can vote.

I see what you're saying, but I don't agree that it works this way. Parents' concerns for their children are far more self-serving than most parents claim. Consider that every "for the children" political agenda ever has nakedly ulterior motives--name one truly pro-child policy where children are directly prioritized at the expense of their parents? Consider the way that school schedules are oriented around their parents' convenience in spite of decades of studies showing the harmful health effects they have. During COVID we saw dramatic efforts to protect the elderly coupled with a push to reopen schools by parents tired of having to take care of them all day. Whatever you think of the restrictions one way or another, the prioritization of elderly was apparent throughout. These are the same parents who have repeated voted benefits for themselves at the direct expense of their children, saddling them with trillions of dollars of debt to support their own present consumption. I promise you, if seniors were regularly being gunned down like this they would have found a solution already.
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