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Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

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Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#201

Post by vfclists »

blitzar wrote: post #32

> Researchers at Amazon had used a series of prompts to get Anthropic’s Fable 5 model to provide them with information that could be used to aid cyberattacks... Are there going to be bans on things that could be used to aid in school shootings next?

Why has HN become utterly useless as a place where meaningful discussions can be held?

A response concerning the model being prompted for information that could be used to aid cyberattaks ie - "Are there going to be bans on things that could be used to aid in school shootings next?" floats right to the top of the comment listings and the responses are quite irrelevant.

What is it with this place?

In the past I came to see what the comments about the articles were is hoping they would share more light on the topic. Right now they are totally meaningless.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#202

Post by hurtigioll »

mindslight wrote: post #180
throwaway85825 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anything that is an argument for extended magazines.

At a certain point numbers just don't work out that way. Being woken up in the middle of the night and facing seven alert and well-prepared attackers? Good luck. The real problem is the corrupt politically-motivated DA who declined to even charge most of the perps. Only one of them got any jail time. The others are still out on our streets. Individual action can help mitigate, but it can't make up for the trend of po…

full auto, defensive grenades

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#204

Post by bloggie »

throwawaytea wrote: post #82
blitzar wrote: post #32

> Researchers at Amazon had used a series of prompts to get Anthropic’s Fable 5 model to provide them with information that could be used to aid cyberattacks... Are there going to be bans on things that could be used to aid in school shootings next?

One infringes on a specific constitutional right. Also, this country would get even more dangerous without good citizens owning guns. IMO it's like herd immunity. Not everyone has guns. But the criminals don't know who does and who doesn't, so in a way they treat all homes as potentially being armed. Our criminals are already pretty care free, I can't imagine how much worse it would be if they KNEW no one was armed.

I'm not American so maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't the Constitution apply to all citizens? Is it not then unconstitutional to prevent federal inmates from possessing firearms while incarcerated?

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#205

Post by plaidfuji »

aix1 wrote: post #2

Given Amazon's fairly large equity stake in Anthropic, I really don't get their motivation. Anyone care to speculate?

As much as it’s tempting to read some kind of ulterior motive into this, I think the most reasonable explanation is that AWS, as perhaps the single biggest point of failure in the backbone of US IT infrastructure, has legitimate concerns about its ability to fend off attacks from bad actors armed with the most advanced models.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#206

Post by adamors »

cmiles8 wrote: post #93

It’s unclear what Jassy’s angle was here doing this. It’s pretty bad news for Anthropic though. They had built up some real momentum but am waking up this morning to nearly everyone I know outside the US shifting use off Anthropic. There is no loyalty or revenue stickiness here. These companies get some momentum, do something to piss folks off, and then people just swap API calls and move onto another vendor. It’s a…

But this doesn't just show that Anthropic is bad news, but essentially that every US based LLM provider is as well. This current administration is making completely random, wild decisions with entirely opaque reasoning.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#207

Post by Topfi »

peyton wrote: post #178
Topfi wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can, just not in the US [0]. I always presumed this is linked to the health care being provided by employers rather than having a more robust safety net that allows for civil disobedience without having to fear existential risks. However, I also can’t forget that the French have their safety net not as a God given right, but because they fought for it via (often not just civil) protest. Reference also the statement…

There are more people not on employer-provided health insurance in the US than exist in France. How does your presumption work given that fact?

I just checked and it's 54% in the US [0] vs 0% in France (cause basic public healthcare isn't tied to employment). So, unless you are referring to absolute numbers (not very helpful when comparing countries of different sizes), I'm not sure what you are referring to.

I will admit that my purely personal thesis on this front goes a bit beyond healthcare. I feel that a robust safety net, iron clad right to protest and a large, at least reasonably financially stable (meaning no existential financial fears for at least the majority of citizenry, i.e. above roughly 60% middle class for a given economy) are needed to allow for protests in such a manner that the citizenry are both capable, willing and informed sufficiently to protect their own interests and democracy as a whole. Having the right and ability to protests is needed, just as much as being comfortable enough to have the time to actually stay politically engaged (consistent financial strain being a reasonable cause for why one doesn't stay informed in my book). France or my home country of Austria (imperfect countries like any other, I will (un)happily admit) on that front are in the 65%-75% range, whereas the US appears to barely get above 50% purely by income along with higher health care costs in general and employer linked plans for as stated above the majority, so these are somewhat interlinked in my view.

Same reason, albeit less extreme, why in war-torn countries, long standing brutal dictatorships and the like, the citizenry rarely is able to create any proper action agains their oppressors, not because they are accepting of the status quo, weak, or anything of the sort, but because when one is starving and trying to help their family unit survive, even beyond the risk that action can pose, their often isn't any time to actually consider it. "A republic, if you can keep it", in my opinion is a high demand from the public. They need to have the tools, rights and resources to actively defend it. Not saying France is perfect here, but I will say that it is easy to just raise our finger at the US populous without considering the whole picture.

[0] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/portion-insured-americans-w...

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#208

Post by bobthepanda »

Topfi wrote: post #137
lebovic wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Claims of retribution aside, one steelman is that Mythos is likely the most capable model that's usable by folks like the NSA [1], and decision-makers across the USG and industry partners have seen a stream of reports of Mythos successfully finding serious vulnerabilities over the past couple months due to Glasswing. So even if GPT 5.5 is just as capable in these scenarios (which, imo, it largely is), it is not known…

I doubt that the capabilities of GPT-5.5-cyber aren’t known by the US government considering OpenAI is their primary LLM partner after Anthropic had concerns about using models for autonomous weaponry and mass surveillance of US citizens. If anything, they should have more experience in GPT-5.5s full feature set due to longer access and may even already have GPT-5.6 access.

Hanlon's razor. Are the people with the right access talking to the right people? Wouldn't be the first time for miscommunication in the executive branch.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#209

Post by eranation »

fny wrote: post #185
eranation wrote: post #146

Just to put things in the right perspective to those who are not aware, Amazon heavily invests in Anthropic [0] and AWS is a partner on project Glasswing (Select companies that used Mythos to find critical vulnerabilities in major open source and critical infrastructure) [1] So I don't think there is anything sinister here, I would use Hanlon's razor [2] here... [0] https://www.anthropic.com/news/anthropic-amazon-com…

To give you further perspective, Amazon has a $50B stake in OpenAI and a $5B stake in Anthropic. If things were flipped, I highly doubt Amazon would be running straight to the feds.

Interesting point. Just a small correction, the Anthropic stake is higher. ($13B + another $20B option if they hit certain milestones, which I believe is almost guaranteed)

So it's closer to $33B

In any case, there is no reason for them to purposefully hurt Anthropic.

I would say that this government "takedown" of Mythos is great free advertising. I mean, if you look at this, they said it's too risky to launch, we all said it's pure marketing, and now when it's actually "banned" for being too risky, we laugh at the "Karma", where in fact, the majority of people who are not in our circles, see it as "wow, they were not kidding".

The overall result is net gain in brand awareness to Anthropic, before an IPO, I think if we had 2 parallel universes with or without this ban, the one with is a much higher IPO outcome for Anthropic than the other.

And again, I think this all needs to be taken with Occam's razor and bit of Hanlon's razor (without going into politics, the technical savviness of this administration is not the thing it's most famous for)

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#210

Post by noelsusman »

vrganj wrote: post #84
Topfi wrote: post #71

I still am struggling to understand why they informed the government about something that is known to be an issue in every LLM. There is no LLM that cannot be jailbroken, so unless this means that we have reached the absolute maximum publicly accessible US made LLMs are allowed to operate at with GPT 5.5, this is not grounded in any sane regulation attempt. Does anyone know what limits Fable 5 has overstepped in the…

Its not Fable 5 that overstepped in the eyes of the US government. It's Anthropic. This is transparent revenge for them daring to try and push back a little on enabling war crimes.

Anthropic is perfectly fine with the US government using Claude to commit war crimes. The US military has done hundreds of extra-judicial killings in the waters around South America over the last year and Anthropic hasn't had anything to say about that.
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